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Hormone depletion and exercise?


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#1 sivies

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Posted 11 April 2015 - 04:45 PM

I started meds about a month and a half ago. Over the past 3 weeks I've had an increase in energy to the point where I've gone back to daily cardio and some yoga. I've been really trying to get back in shape and lose some of this weight! All of a sudden, my energy is now plummeting again! I'm wondering if the exercise is depleting the hormones I'm taking? I'm going back to the Endo at the end of the month to look at my levels and dosage. Does exercise "use up" thyroid hormones? Does an increase in exercise require an increased dosage? I'm curious as to what others experiences are.

 

Thank you!


History of allergies, dermatographism, flat curve glucose tolerance test. Family history of autoimmune disorders on both sides including Adult Onset Type I Diabetes, Hypothyroid, Hyperparathyroid, Psoriasis, and Ulcerative Colitis amongst family members.

 

Most current numbers:

 

TSH - 1.39 (different ranges in two different labs but Endo wants me at 1)

FT4 - .90 (.57-1.25)

FT3 - 3.5 (2.2-4.3)

AntiThyG - 4 (0-4)

Anti TPO - 550 (0-9)

 

Currently taking generic 25mcg Levothyroxine and 10 mcg Liothyronine


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#2 Lovlkn

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Posted 11 April 2015 - 05:12 PM

If your FT-4 and FT-3 were closer to 3/4 of range you may not have this issue.

 

Also, have you had your Ferritin and B-12 checked?

 

What is your sugar/carb intake like?  Are you having a crash?

 

It's not always thyroid related, however if your thyroid hormones are not in the 3/4 of range what thyroid hormone you are burning up may be contributing.


Free T-4 and Free T-3 are absolutely necessary to properly dose yourself.
My experience is that 1/2 - 3/4 of range is your goal for optimal treatment

My Journey... 7 years to receive a diagnosis. TT 2004 after 4.5 years on Tapazole that had to be adjusted monthly - endo ran labs every 4 weeks. Remission was never going to happen for me so I opted for surgery to remove. Final DX by surgeon was Hashitoxicosis, TPO antibodies over 2000 and TSI 316% within the year prior to surgery. I never had a ultrasound or any lab testing to rule out cancer - pathology was negative. Post surgery I was kept hypo for many years - until I figured out how to dose my self, relying on where I fell in the FT-4 and FT-3 labs. I run TSH below range due to positive TBII antibodies. Horrible time adjusting to addition of Cytomel = patience pays off when adding this drug to the mix.

The happy ending ---> Stable dose since 1/10 Unithroid 125mcg, Cytomel 12.5mcg - labs I can live with.

None of the information on ThyroidBoards.com is intended to diagnose, treat, cure or prevent any disease. Information shared is based on my personal experiences and should not be considered medical advice. Please consult a physician before adjusting any medication.

#3 KeepOnGoing

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Posted 11 April 2015 - 09:07 PM

I'm currently going through precisely this problem - I feel better, up the exercise and then feel worse again. In my case, my FT3 is in the basement, so every time I run my body seems to use up all the T3 I'm taking and then somehow forces my body to use some T4 (which it is generally not very keen to do). So I end up with low TSH, low FT4 and low FT3 (which isn't supposed to be possible, but there we are!)

 

So then I increase my dose and the cycle starts again.

 

I've done a lot of running in the past, so I know I'm not over-training and it's not my diet etc which is causing the problem.  My ferritin etc are all ok, so I'm convinced that exercise uses up thyroxin, in a major way.

 

My hope is that eventually I will find a dose which allows me to exercise without the crash. My situation is complicated by being a thyca survivor who is on TSH suppression, so I'm not operating within normal ranges anyway.

 

So far I've added 25mcg of T4 and 5mcg of T3 to the mix - the extra T4 made only a little difference to both my blood tests and my energy, so we can only hope that the extra T3 will help.

 

I'm trying to look on the positive side - at least I actually feel like running, for the first time in years... I'm determined not to give up.



#4 joplin1975

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Posted 11 April 2015 - 11:50 PM

Yes, it absolutely happens. Based on weight, I should be on a 112mcgs dose...I'm on 150 because I'm very active.
Papillary cancer with lymph node involvement
Total Thyroidectomy 8/29/11
TSH 71.17 on 9/14/11
RAI 100mci 9/23/11
Starting point for replacement meds: 50 mcgs of Synthroid, TSH 121.88 on 11/8/11; 100 mcgs of Synthroid, TSH 43.21 on 12/9/11; 137 mcgs of Synthroid, TSH 7.88 on 1/11/12; TSH 8.38 on 2/9/12, 150 mcgs of Synthroid, TSH 2.81 on 3/27/12, TSH 0.54 on 5/8/12, TSH 0.78 on 8/8/12, TSH 0.39 on 12/20/12, TSH 0.24 on 3/5/13, TSH 0.33 on 4/15/14, TSH .12 on 3/10/15, TSH 0.21 on 9/15/2016, TSH .12 on 2/17/17.

#5 sivies

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Posted 12 April 2015 - 05:27 AM

Thank you all! It's such a bummer! I took two days off from exercise to see if my energy would come back. It did a little bit. I didn't feel the brain fog which had returned with exercise. I will stick with the yoga and just do less cardio...maybe shorter bursts or something until I see my doc. I had REALLY increased back to my "old" levels - hiking 6 miles and going to the gym to do cardio daily. I think I may have been too enthusiastic!

 

Oh and Lovlkn, it's not a "crash" after the exercise. It's just a deadening that starts to happen, the brain fog comes back, I have no personality, and I feel drained in an apathetic sort of way. I get no "boost" from the exercise like I did when I first started to feel better. I was starting to feel like a rock star and then BOOM! Let's hope a med increase helps!

 

Thanks!


History of allergies, dermatographism, flat curve glucose tolerance test. Family history of autoimmune disorders on both sides including Adult Onset Type I Diabetes, Hypothyroid, Hyperparathyroid, Psoriasis, and Ulcerative Colitis amongst family members.

 

Most current numbers:

 

TSH - 1.39 (different ranges in two different labs but Endo wants me at 1)

FT4 - .90 (.57-1.25)

FT3 - 3.5 (2.2-4.3)

AntiThyG - 4 (0-4)

Anti TPO - 550 (0-9)

 

Currently taking generic 25mcg Levothyroxine and 10 mcg Liothyronine


#6 KeepOnGoing

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Posted 12 April 2015 - 08:38 AM

My experience suggests that an increase in dose WILL help, but until your dose is optimal for you and the exercise you want to do, you will continue to need further increases. 

 

It's extremely tiresome, in all sorts of ways...

 

It's probably a good idea to start out gently and work up to what you used to do. I used to run marathons and half marathons but at present am settling for 2 x 40 mins run/walk a week. I'm just now saying that I want to increase that and can I have the extra T3 I'm going to need now, as opposed to waiting until I crash again. 

 

Does anyone know of any research into the effect of exercise on thyroid levels? I'd love to have something to show the oncologist who, I suspect, would just like me to stay fat and unfit but with (to him, anyway) perfect lab results. I never felt well on his idea of perfect results so he'll just have to cope...



#7 puritanize

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Posted 12 April 2015 - 04:44 PM

Your thyroid is your body's energy. So crashes are likely and working out will stress it. Your adrenals may not be able to take it either.  It's like having your foot on the brake and gas at the same time, Your thyroid cannot handle it. You are burning yourself out.

 

My thyroid is not so bad as most of the folks here, it's healing and all is going well thus far, however my adrenals are trashed still thus like my doc says makes me exercise intolerant right now. I have to keep it light and be careful. Now that we are moving on to my adrenals and hormones as far as treatment (After getting my C4A levels down form 16,000 to 2,400), I hope to be able to increase working out and my strength soon. However my energy levels where he has me and what he has me on is near 100% daily, working out only causes me to crash. 

 

Just my experiences and what I was told about that. I had many questions for my doc on this subject.



#8 sivies

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Posted 13 April 2015 - 07:09 PM

KeepOnGoing...I found this in my research.

 

http://www.nel.edu/2...A14_Ciloglu.pdf

 

Here is the cliffs note version:

 

RESULTS
: The results of this study show that exercise performed at the anaerobic
threshold (70% of maximum heart rate, lactate level 4.59 ± 1.75 mmol/l) caused
the most prominent changes in the amount of any hormone values. While the
rate of T4, fT4, and TSH continued to rise at 90% of maximum heart rate, the rate
of T3 and fT3 started to fall.
CONCLUSIONS
: Maximal aerobic exercise greatly affects the level of circulating
thyroid hormones.

History of allergies, dermatographism, flat curve glucose tolerance test. Family history of autoimmune disorders on both sides including Adult Onset Type I Diabetes, Hypothyroid, Hyperparathyroid, Psoriasis, and Ulcerative Colitis amongst family members.

 

Most current numbers:

 

TSH - 1.39 (different ranges in two different labs but Endo wants me at 1)

FT4 - .90 (.57-1.25)

FT3 - 3.5 (2.2-4.3)

AntiThyG - 4 (0-4)

Anti TPO - 550 (0-9)

 

Currently taking generic 25mcg Levothyroxine and 10 mcg Liothyronine


#9 KeepOnGoing

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Posted 13 April 2015 - 08:23 PM

Thanks, Sivies, I hadn't seen that research before.

 

Interestingly, this research talks about increases in FT4 and FT3 during exercise - whereas mine seem to plummet downwards... Always knew I was odd!

 

Guess I'll just have to keep experimenting with different levels and exercise regimes until I find the one that works for me...



#10 KeepOnGoing

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Posted 14 April 2015 - 07:02 AM

Actually, I think I might have worked it out...

 

The study was in young, healthy athletes who have a thyroid which, naturally, increased the supply of thyroid hormones when they exercised.

 

Of course, not having a thyroid at all, I'm not in that situation. Somehow, I've got to allow for that increased requirement for thyroxin in my daily dose, which is never going to be as effective as the body's own system, but can at least be replicated in some way.

 

I'll keep on trying to work it out... Nothing is ever quick, or easy, with thyroids.



#11 webster2

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Posted 22 April 2015 - 10:38 AM

I have been actively exercising since early December.  I have lost close to 30 pounds. I had been feeling the best ever.  In the past two weeks, I started to feel what I thought were hypo symptoms.  I sent my endo an email asking to test TSH, FT3, and FT4.  I had the test yesterday and was really surprised by the results.  My question is this a typical result of exercising and eating well.  I thought I would require more replacement.

 

4/2015

 

TSH  .25  (.35-5.00)

FT3    3.2  (2.3-4.2)

FT4    1,7   (.8-1.8)

 

12/2014  * I felt great

 

TSH  2.00

FT3  2.8

FT4  1.4

 

 

I have been on the same dosage for 2 years, I think.  Any thoughts?  I feel like the tin man and can hardly move.


Thyroid Storm June 2011

Graves Disease DX June 13, 2011
Completion Thyroidectomy July 28, 2011
(right side removed 11/14/1990)
Papillary Cancer
2.25 grains Nature-throid (11/2011-8/2013)
still looking for the correct dose 12/3 (125 mcg 5 x week 112 2x week) 5 mcg cytomel  2 x day
Life is very good! :)


#12 joplin1975

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Posted 22 April 2015 - 11:01 AM

If you've lost 30 pounds, I think that's the issue...not so much the activity & diet changes. With your free t4 sneaking up to close to top of the range, your symptoms make sense to me. I would think a minor reduction in meds might make sense.
Papillary cancer with lymph node involvement
Total Thyroidectomy 8/29/11
TSH 71.17 on 9/14/11
RAI 100mci 9/23/11
Starting point for replacement meds: 50 mcgs of Synthroid, TSH 121.88 on 11/8/11; 100 mcgs of Synthroid, TSH 43.21 on 12/9/11; 137 mcgs of Synthroid, TSH 7.88 on 1/11/12; TSH 8.38 on 2/9/12, 150 mcgs of Synthroid, TSH 2.81 on 3/27/12, TSH 0.54 on 5/8/12, TSH 0.78 on 8/8/12, TSH 0.39 on 12/20/12, TSH 0.24 on 3/5/13, TSH 0.33 on 4/15/14, TSH .12 on 3/10/15, TSH 0.21 on 9/15/2016, TSH .12 on 2/17/17.

#13 VFRgrl

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Posted 22 April 2015 - 06:33 PM

Very interested in this thread. I'm having my TT on June 10 and I'm a very active person. I'm terrified I won't be able to exercise after my TT and do the activities I enjoy.

I've already determined that my body HATES being hyper- I can't exercise and I GAIN weight when hyper- BUT my body hates HYPO too. I can't get to a "good" spot with my blood levels. Actually, not true- my very first blood test I felt good but that only looked at Ft4 and TSH.

I'm hoping I'll be able to learn from the others on this thread! I have a huge event the first week of Oct. A dog agility event (national Championships) where I will need to RUN for high intensity short intervals twice a day. Its an event that is important to me since this is the last time I'll probably be able to run my current agility dog at a national championship event.

I'm hoping the TT doesn't completely ruin any chance I have of doing this event.

Lori


2012-2015: 40lbs weight gain; extreme fatigue-Jan 2015: Physical exam found large goiter:Anti-thyroglobulin: <20 IU/mL Tsi (Thyroid-stimulating Immunoglobulin), Serum Normal <89 %baseline (No reference range given) ..Thyroxine, Free (FT4): 1.62 NG/dL (range 0.83-1.77 ng/dL)TSH: <0.005 uIU/mLUltrasound: Multiple nodules; largest 5.4cm complex compositionFNAB: InconclusiveRecommend to have TT

2/25/2015-06/10/2015: Up and down with Methimazole; mostly hypo could not get dosage correct. Uptake scan showed large cold nodule, small "hot" nodules on other side, recommend TT due to large cold nodule being compressive, other side causing hyper symptoms.

06/10/2015: TT completed. Levels on 6/11/15: TSH: 7.77; FT4: 0.7 (0.8-1.8); T3: 0.67 (0.80-2.00) 125mg Levo

07/21/2015: Would like to put the diseased thyroid back in. Sick, vertigo, "not thyroid" according to doctors but NEVER had these issues prior. Depressed

07/21/2015: TSH: 4.360 (0.450-4500); Free T4: 1.51 (0.82-1.77); Free T3; 2.1 (2.0-4.4); Diagnosed as probably type 2 diabetes- NEVER had issues with blood sugar even when I was 40# heavier. REGRET SURGERY EVERY.SINGLE.DAY

 


#14 joplin1975

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Posted 22 April 2015 - 07:23 PM

I think you will be ok in October, VFR. I'm not saying you will be perfect, but you should be good enough to get it done. 

 

It's really hard to imagine, from where you are sitting now, how you will feel after a TT, but my experience was that it wasn't a night and day/black or white kind of a thing. There were lots of shades of grey. I had a horrible post-op medication experience but at five months out I was able to run. 


  • VFRgrl likes this
Papillary cancer with lymph node involvement
Total Thyroidectomy 8/29/11
TSH 71.17 on 9/14/11
RAI 100mci 9/23/11
Starting point for replacement meds: 50 mcgs of Synthroid, TSH 121.88 on 11/8/11; 100 mcgs of Synthroid, TSH 43.21 on 12/9/11; 137 mcgs of Synthroid, TSH 7.88 on 1/11/12; TSH 8.38 on 2/9/12, 150 mcgs of Synthroid, TSH 2.81 on 3/27/12, TSH 0.54 on 5/8/12, TSH 0.78 on 8/8/12, TSH 0.39 on 12/20/12, TSH 0.24 on 3/5/13, TSH 0.33 on 4/15/14, TSH .12 on 3/10/15, TSH 0.21 on 9/15/2016, TSH .12 on 2/17/17.

#15 KeepOnGoing

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Posted 24 April 2015 - 03:36 PM

Even at my worst, I could manage bursts of energy - it was more that I couldn't keep it up day after day. If I had a busy weekend then I needed to plan a couple of 'recovery days' afterwards.

 

I'm beginning to wonder whether I should take an extra bit of T3 on the days when I go running? If I run in the morning, I feel really dreadful for the rest of the day, which is a pain. So I'm thinking of trying taking an extra 5mcg (I take 20mcg T3 every day) after I've run - only on those days (I run twice a week at present). I'm trying to mimic what a normal, functioning thyroid would do, and provide a bit extra when it's needed.

 

Does this sound sensible? Or is T3 not THAT quick-acting?

 

All comments (including "Are you mad?") welcome.



#16 joplin1975

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Posted 24 April 2015 - 04:20 PM

I'm not sure as I've never fiddled with t3, but I am wondering about timing: when do you normally take your t3 and when do you normally run?


Papillary cancer with lymph node involvement
Total Thyroidectomy 8/29/11
TSH 71.17 on 9/14/11
RAI 100mci 9/23/11
Starting point for replacement meds: 50 mcgs of Synthroid, TSH 121.88 on 11/8/11; 100 mcgs of Synthroid, TSH 43.21 on 12/9/11; 137 mcgs of Synthroid, TSH 7.88 on 1/11/12; TSH 8.38 on 2/9/12, 150 mcgs of Synthroid, TSH 2.81 on 3/27/12, TSH 0.54 on 5/8/12, TSH 0.78 on 8/8/12, TSH 0.39 on 12/20/12, TSH 0.24 on 3/5/13, TSH 0.33 on 4/15/14, TSH .12 on 3/10/15, TSH 0.21 on 9/15/2016, TSH .12 on 2/17/17.

#17 KeepOnGoing

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Posted 24 April 2015 - 04:36 PM

I normally take my T3 first thing in the morning. When I run varies quite a bit - if I run late pm, then I can cope with being exhausted for the rest of the day. But this morning I ran at 10am and I'm really struggling now. I'm supposed to be changing to go out for dinner, but I'm just sat here, staring into space and wondering if my legs still work!

 

Just wondered if you can use T3 like this? Does anyone have any experience? Not worried about ending up hyper (FT3 is right at the bottom of the range) but just don't know if it would be effective.

 

Right, I REALLY MUST move!






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