# Is Hashis linked to cancer?



## Negative101 (May 23, 2011)

Does Hashimitos increase cancer risks?
Blood test found the following:
Thyroid Peroxidase 130 (range is less than 35)

Im just wondering if Hashimito's is linked to thyroid cancer, in any way? My Endo is taking the "wait and see approach" and hasnt schedueled an ultrasound until October (6months away!).... Should I take a visit to the ER and see what they have to say?

I can live with Hashi's, but cancer is a different story.... Id want that taken care of asap if at all possible.

Thanks all
*


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## Andros (Aug 26, 2009)

Negative101 said:


> Does Hashimitos increase cancer risks?
> Blood test found the following:
> Thyroid Peroxidase 130 (range is less than 35)
> 
> ...


Hi there and welcome! Yes indeed;

Graves' and Hashi's cancer
http://www.thyroidmanager.org/Chapter18/18-cancothr.htm

TPO is not definitive of Hashimoto's, it is "suggestive!" Further testing should be done.

TPO
http://www.nlm.nih.gov/medlineplus/ency/article/003556.htm

In my humble opinion, only FNA is conclusive.
Hashimoto's Hurthle cells
http://www.pathconsultddx.com/pathCon/diagnosis?pii=S1559-8675(06)71549-2


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## Negative101 (May 23, 2011)

Thank you Andros

My blood work also showed a tsh of 4.49 (range went up to 5) and also FT4 of 18 is a range of 12-22.... Also the tpo of 130, range is less than 35.
I'm a 26 year old male and this potential of cancer is worrying me sick! I got maybe an hour of sleep last night 

Would it be correct to assume that cancer is pretty rare, even in Hashis patients? Also, how's the outlook for those with thyroid cancer?

My doc is taking the wait and see approach because my FT4 seems decent. Shouldn't I be medicated to try and reduce the anti bodies?

Thank you!


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## bigfoot (May 13, 2011)

Hello from another newbie. I am surprised that your TSH is 4.49 and no thyroid medication has been prescribed, but I am no expert. Aside from the recent lab work, how do you actually _feel_ on a day-to-day basis? Any signs or symptoms you've noticed? When my TSH was that high it was all I could do to function. (Caveat emptor -- I know everyone is different.)

I can't comment on the cancer risk, as I am just beginning this journey myself. At least your doctor even suggested getting an ultrasound! Mine hasn't mentioned that at all. So definitely count yourself lucky there.

Hang in there! It's a lot to learn, but the wonderful folks here are full of support and information. :anim_32:


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## Negative101 (May 23, 2011)

From my understanding, tsh can fluctuate 3 points on any given day.... So u can be 1 and later a 4.... Apparently the better tests are the free Ts...
I feel fine to be honest... A lil tired and a lil cold sometimes, but nothing serious by any means


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## bigfoot (May 13, 2011)

Wow, if you got a doctor to admit to that, I am impressed! Watch the tiredness and cold feeling; other symptoms can start to pile up over time. Fingers crossed for a good ultrasound for you and a smart doctor who actually listens. Keep us updated!


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## Andros (Aug 26, 2009)

Negative101 said:


> Thank you Andros
> 
> My blood work also showed a tsh of 4.49 (range went up to 5) and also FT4 of 18 is a range of 12-22.... Also the tpo of 130, range is less than 35.
> I'm a 26 year old male and this potential of cancer is worrying me sick! I got maybe an hour of sleep last night
> ...


I am glad you posted those labs. While they look okay, I don't think they are at all suitable. Most of us feel best with TSH @ 1.0 or less and the FREE T4 and FREE T3 (too bad that test was not run), about 3/4's in the range given by your lab.

Also, I used to think cancer of the thyroid was rare but I don't any more. I don't know if it is because detection is better or that it is on the rise because of some environmental factor (cell phones?) or both.

So, I don't dance around when it comes to urging folks to press for further testing and sonogram at the very least, RAIU (radioactive uptake) at the very best.

men more likely to have cancer than women
http://www.umm.edu/endocrin/thytum.htm

I agree w/Bigfoot. I think that the doc should Rx thyroxine replacement. You do have some clinical symptoms as well.

And I seriously recommend these tests.

TSI (thyroid stimulating immunoglobulin),TPO (antimicrosomal antibodies) TBII (thyrotropin-binding inhibitory immunoglobulin), Thyroglobulin Ab, ANA (antinuclear antibodies), (thyroid hormone panel) TSH, Free T3, Free T4.

You can look this stuff up here and more.........
http://www.labtestsonline.org/

Do you ever have swollen lymph nodes in the clavicle/neck area?

I am a big believer in listening to your "inner doctor" so if something is niggling you about cancer, I believe you should push for resolution one way or the other.


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## Negative101 (May 23, 2011)

I'm a natural hypochondriac..., worried about everything. If there's a risk of cancer, i assume the worst lol

Never had swollen nodes in my neck before, although I do often get sore or infected throats when I catch colds


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## Negative101 (May 23, 2011)

I should mention that my endo said he didn't want to prescribe me anything because my Ft4 is optimal... Although no ft3 yet. He said medication can make me go hyperthyroid at this time (with my #s), so he's taking a wait and see approach


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## Andros (Aug 26, 2009)

Negative101 said:


> I should mention that my endo said he didn't want to prescribe me anything because my Ft4 is optimal... Although no ft3 yet. He said medication can make me go hyperthyroid at this time (with my #s), so he's taking a wait and see approach


It's only one point above the mid-range given by your lab and due to the fact that FT3 is your active hormone, I can't say I agree with his thinking on that. However, I certainly am not a doctor.

http://www.thyroid-info.com/articles/freet3woliner.htm

Glad you have never had swollen lymph glands. Maybe you have had an underlying condition for a long long time which could make you think you are a hypochondriac.

In any case, we are all here to be helpful and supportive so stick around. Lots to learn on this board; and I do mean a lot. Just packed w/credible information.


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## lainey (Aug 26, 2010)

Negative101 said:


> Does Hashimitos increase cancer risks?
> Blood test found the following:
> Thyroid Peroxidase 130 (range is less than 35)
> 
> ...


You realize, don't you, that it's a really big leap from mildly hypothyroid labs to cancer?

There are about 37,000 cases of thyroid cancers diagnosed each year.

This compares with about 190,000 cases of invasive breast cancer, 101,000 cases of colon cancer, 217,000 cases of prostate cancer out of approximately 1.4 million new cases diagnosed each year.

Thyroid cancer is not detected through blood work, but via ultra-sound or radioactive iodine screening of the thyroid itself, looking for abnormal growths. An experienced doctor can palpate many of these growths themselves.

You really should relax re: sleepless nights. If you are that bothered, ask the endo to refer you for an ultrasound screening. They would be looking for nodules in the thyroid gland itself, or other abnormalities. However, keep in mind that even then, about 40% of the general population has thyroid nodules (that % is slightly higher in people with thyroid problems) and that these are benign at a rate of about 95%.

Unless you have other specific symptoms of growths on your thyroid, the chances of cancer are really very low.


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## Negative101 (May 23, 2011)

Thank you Lainey
Those are indeed reassuring words!

Told u, I'm a worry wart


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## Negative101 (May 23, 2011)

Okay, still no medication

ok, so these are last weeks results:
eTSH: 4.49 (0.35 - 5.00)
T4 Free 18 (12 - 22)
Thyroid Peroxidase AB 130 (<35)

These are todays results from the hospital (went in to get a referral for an ultrasound tomorrow)

Ranges are in brackets

TSH: 2 (.34-6.6)
FT4: 13.5 (7.5-21.1)
FT3: 5.1 (3.8-6.0)

Symptoms: none, feel perfectly fine


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## lainey (Aug 26, 2010)

Those labs are pretty normal.

If you have no symptoms, there really isn't any need for medication.

Why did you go to an endo originally?


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## Negative101 (May 23, 2011)

lainey said:


> Those labs are pretty normal.
> 
> If you have no symptoms, there really isn't any need for medication.
> 
> Why did you go to an endo originally?


Originally for non thyroid stuff... I have low testosterone for my age. 
Endo decided to run a set of blood tests and included the antibodies in them which showed them....

My thinking is that he ordered them as not only part if his blood work up, but also to see if my symptoms (low sex drive) was in any way related to my other hormones (thyroid)....

I was thinking I should be medicated because it helps keep the anti bodies down, rather than waiting for an inevitable destruction

At the end, he said "were just going to watch it for now.... If I medicate u, you may go hyperthyroid, and we dont want that"

Pretty much, without the antibodies, everything looks normal


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## Butterfly2004 (May 23, 2011)

Hi everyone - I new to the board and I am almost a graves veteran - graves has been my buddy for the past 7 years.

I have always been very "high" energy - never needed too much sleep - very active in sports - karate, kickboxing- etc good cardio. So it was with great fear when all of a sudden I couldn't walk up the stairs at my office - holding the railing to help me along. It came out of no - where - my feet and calves swelled up - so much so that I couldn't wear any of my shoes - thank god it was winter!

A whole bunch of scary thoughts as they ran me through the tests -they looked for blood clots and a host of others that I can't recall - in the end (about 2 months later) - I had the RAI.

The scariest part was when my cardiologist - said to meet him at the hospital and - he was waiting for me in emergency. Then taking me by the hand and pulling me through all the tests - literally - fast tracked - made it even more scary!

In the end - no blood clots - and graves was the winner. 
I am very lucky to have doctors who were efficient, cooperative and confident!

about 4 years ago I was introduced to his bratty cousin - TED in my right eye and last year completed the decompression surgeries (2) + lids and thought I was good to go. 2 months ago - my routine checkups with my endro moved to 6 months with my family doctor monitoring my bloodwork every two months - all seemed good. November I thought I had a migraine - by February my eye had moved out from 6 mm. TED (thyroid eye disease) was back with a vengance. I looked like I had gotten on the wrong end of a fight. This time very agressive - now I am on an additional 60 day PREDNIXONE regime. 3 more years ...


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## Butterfly2004 (May 23, 2011)

The cancer thought has been on my mind too. I have been stressing the past 2 weeks - my doc and I will be having that chat in 2 weeks - so I can have a real understanding. I appreciate the stat's that were posted earlier.

I know I can get through the left eye problem - but what happens if I get another "version' -

I'm sorry about my ranting but I really need to get the fear out. I don't want to worry my family unnecessarily - so thank you for having this board.


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## lainey (Aug 26, 2010)

>>>I was thinking I should be medicated because it helps keep the anti bodies down, rather than waiting for an inevitable destruction<<<

You can't take thyroid hormones as a preventative treatment. It doesn't work that way. T4 is a replacement for what your body doesn't make--so as long as your thyroid is producing, it's pretty much watch and wait.

Thyroid antibodies can occur in the generally population--just because you have them, as long as your levels are normal and you are asymptomatic, it does not mean that you DO have a problem, but that you MAY develop one (and, you do not have to have thyroid antibodies to develop a thyroid problem).

Your most recent free T3 and T4 numbers are nearly at midpoint in the range--an excellent place to be.


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## Andros (Aug 26, 2009)

Butterfly2004 said:


> Hi everyone - I new to the board and I am almost a graves veteran - graves has been my buddy for the past 7 years.
> 
> I have always been very "high" energy - never needed too much sleep - very active in sports - karate, kickboxing- etc good cardio. So it was with great fear when all of a sudden I couldn't walk up the stairs at my office - holding the railing to help me along. It came out of no - where - my feet and calves swelled up - so much so that I couldn't wear any of my shoes - thank god it was winter!
> 
> ...


Hi and welcome!









So, I take it that you have not had RAI or ablation of your thyroid?

What treatment have you been on all this time?


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## Negative101 (May 23, 2011)

Ultrasound done

Thyroid is a little on the large side but within the normal limit

And...... NO nodules


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## bigfoot (May 13, 2011)

Wow, that was quick! Congrats on the good ultrasound results! See, nothing to worry about...


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## Negative101 (May 23, 2011)

bigfoot said:


> Wow, that was quick! Congrats on the good ultrasound results! See, nothing to worry about...


Thank you 

Yes, when I'm worried I tend to get things done quick lol

I am curious tho, how likely is it that this is even hashi's? Ice read that nodules are a characteristic of Hashis and I don't have them? This combined with my low level of TPO antibodies (130), and the lack of most symptoms makes me wonder...... 
Maybe I'm just in the early stages, or maybe the antibodies aren't even Hashis.... Who knows!


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## Andros (Aug 26, 2009)

Negative101 said:


> Thank you
> 
> Yes, when I'm worried I tend to get things done quick lol
> 
> ...


Clustered grape-like nodules and exceedingly high TPO (antimicrosomal Ab) are suggestive of Hashimoto's. The reason why is that these two things are commonly found in patients' with Hashimoto's.

I personally do not consider that definitive. FNA (fine needle aspiration) would be if certain Hurthle Cells indigenous to Hashimoto's were found to be present.

Histologic diagnosis of Hashimoto's
http://emedicine.medscape.com/article/120937-diagnosis

Hashimoto's Hurthle cells
http://www.pathconsultddx.com/pathCon/diagnosis?pii=S1559-8675(06)71549-2


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## Negative101 (May 23, 2011)

Just left the office of an internist (doctor) who stated pretty much the same as what Andros has been saying -- that the antibodies alone are not worth much for a diagnosis.

However, his next comment of "and if you had hashi's, you would be hypothyroid, meaning TSH over 5.0" made me lose my confidence in him *sigh*


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## Andros (Aug 26, 2009)

Negative101 said:


> Just left the office of an internist (doctor) who stated pretty much the same as what Andros has been saying -- that the antibodies alone are not worth much for a diagnosis.
> 
> However, his next comment of "and if you had hashi's, you would be hypothyroid, meaning TSH over 5.0" made me lose my confidence in him *sigh*


It's a known fact that many with Hashi's go flit back and forth between hypo and hyper. Sigh is right.

So, what did this doctor recommend and what did he do besides talk to you? Did he do more labs?


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## Negative101 (May 23, 2011)

Andros said:


> It's a known fact that many with Hashi's go flit back and forth between hypo and hyper. Sigh is right.
> 
> So, what did this doctor recommend and what did he do besides talk to you? Did he do more labs?


He didnt recommend anything at all... he looked at my blood work, and looked at my thyroid ultrasound and then examined my thyroid.

My recent blood worked showed a TSH of 2 and a high medium T4, and a high T3. Ultrasound said my thyroid as no nodules, is homogeneous, and is completely normal... except its on the "higher" side of normal (I guess in size)

He said "the anti bodies can be from a # of things... Doesnt mean you have Hashimitos, and from your blood work and ultrasound, I see no reason to think you have it"

I asked for a referral to an endo and he said fine... Wait is about 3 months long here, unfortunately


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## northernlite (Oct 28, 2010)

If you feel fine, you don't want to mess with it and start medication. Your thyroid is doing it's job well now if you have good FT4 and FT3. You will know if and when you swing hypo or hyper and you don't want to start the process by medicating yourself right now when your body is well balanced. Just have a thyroid panel run annually and head to the doctor sooner if you become symptomatic either way.

I am diagnosed Hashi's with no nodules that can be felt.


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## lainey (Aug 26, 2010)

Negative101 said:


> He didnt recommend anything at all... he looked at my blood work, and looked at my thyroid ultrasound and then examined my thyroid.
> 
> My recent blood worked showed a TSH of 2 and a high medium T4, and a high T3. Ultrasound said my thyroid as no nodules, is homogeneous, and is completely normal... except its on the "higher" side of normal (I guess in size)
> 
> ...


The presence of antibodies doesn't necessarily mean that you have a problem--just like having high cholesterol doesn't mean you have heart disease--it means you MAY have the potential for one, so you should continue to monitor the thyroid with annual bloodwork.

What exactly, with normal results in bloodwork and ultrasound, were you expecting the doctor to tell you?


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## Andros (Aug 26, 2009)

Negative101 said:


> He didnt recommend anything at all... he looked at my blood work, and looked at my thyroid ultrasound and then examined my thyroid.
> 
> My recent blood worked showed a TSH of 2 and a high medium T4, and a high T3. Ultrasound said my thyroid as no nodules, is homogeneous, and is completely normal... except its on the "higher" side of normal (I guess in size)
> 
> ...


See if you can get your name on a cancellation list.


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## Butterfly2004 (May 23, 2011)

Yes I did have the RAI - but interestingly enough - I have been finding information that says that there have been instances where AFTER the RAI - TED (Tyhroid eye disease) shows up - and in my case at least - this has been proven to be true.

I have thought back - and really given the situation at the time - not sure what my alternatives might have been. In 2004 definitely had to take strong action to deal with the thyroid itself.

TED has been a challenge - but we are working our way through.


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