# Hypo and low sex drive -- male sex organ issues



## davethyroid (Feb 20, 2015)

Hey everyone.

I've searched around and found some similar posts but nothing exactly like what I'm experiencing.

I've had Hashimotos for about 10 years, for the past year I've been taking a little over 2 grain/ day and that has worked remarkably well compared to the synthroid I was taking for 9 years. Generally, I feel great. I have my energy back, my old personality. everything is good.

However I still have nearly 0 sex drive. I don't have sex dreams, I don't have much of a desire to have sex. It has ruined countless relationships (which I want to have).

I have had my testosterone checked, and they said it was fine.

I take quite a few of the supplements detailed in Isabella Wentz's book. I also take metformin.

Another issue that I believe is related is my testicles are behaving very weirdly when I ejaculate. (slightly embarrassing, stick with me)

Both testicles go into my body every time I ejaculate. I have to push them out. This is new over the last few years. Could it be an issue with Armour?

Just generally speaking, the scrotum is tight almost all the time and the testicles don't seem to hang at all anymore. Again, this is a new thing.

I've read other forums saying "this is normal", however, this is not "my" normal, so it's an issue I'd like to address. Beyond making me self conscious, I have to believe it can't be healthy.

Any advice is appreciated. I have a doctors appointment in a month and I'll talk to them about it then.

Thanks


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## Andros (Aug 26, 2009)

http://www.mayoclinic.org/diseases-conditions/retractile-testicle/basics/causes/con-20024856

Welcome to the board!

Well; I am not sure this is due to thyroid and/or diabetes. Please read the above and strongly consider seeing the appropriate doctor about this.

Also, what are you taking 2 grains of? Armour?

When was the last time you had an ultra-sound of your thyroid? Since you are male, this is even more important that it is for the fairer gender.

We have many men on the board. Perhaps some can give better advice or comments than I have?

In any case, a dysfunctional endocrine system causes all kinds of problems. It's all about the hormones.


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## joplin1975 (Jul 21, 2011)

What, exactly, was your free testosterone result? And did a board certified urologist give you a testicular exam?


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## Alan654 (Feb 21, 2015)

I've had Hashimotos for about 10 years, for the past year I've been taking a little over 2 grain/ day and that has worked remarkably well compared to the synthroid I was taking for 9 years.


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## Lovlkn (Dec 20, 2009)

> I have had my testosterone checked, and they said it was fine.


Get a copy of this report and post the result with ranges please.


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## fttfbass (Jan 8, 2014)

davethyroid said:


> I have had my testosterone checked, and they said it was fine.


I was told the same thing by my endocrinologist when my testosterone was checked. But, after getting the lab numbers and doing some digging around on the internet, it looks like my free testosterone is average for a male in his mid 50's and my total testosterone is average for a male in his 80's. I'm only 33. In most cases, they'll wait until your total testosterone drops below 300 until they will admit that you are low and do something about it.

Low thyroid can affect all of your hormones, so I'm going to have my testosterone rechecked once my thyroid levels are somewhat under control.


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## cujet (Feb 6, 2015)

davethyroid said:


> 1) I've had Hashimotos for about 10 years,
> 
> 2) However I still have nearly 0 sex drive. I don't have sex dreams, I don't have much of a desire to have sex.
> 
> ...


Good Afternoon davethyroid,

1) I'm 51, male, hashi's. I've had it for 25 years. I can only offer up my experiences and my results. But, without a doubt, I've learned something critically important. Hashimoto's is an autoimmune disease. Treating the thyroid is simply treating one symptom of the disease. Your doc likely knows all of this, but won't regurgitate all 300 potential symptoms to you. (of course, some are female in nature and won't apply) . HOWEVER, if you are having an issue, you must address it if you want relief. The disease has caused me more trouble than I'd like to admit.

2) Low T

3) Is it 500-600 or above? If not, you won't likely have much sex drive or dreams.

4) OK, list them. Some may help, some may not.

5) Not unusual from what I understand and mirrors my experience. In my case, testicles shrank markedly and simply pull up easily due to lower mass and smaller size. If I discontinue T, they now get larger and no longer retract. (However discontinuation causes my T levels plummet to levels well below what they were prior to prescription T, and I feel awful) But, they shrank before starting T, guessing because they were not stimulated to produce on their own. In essence, they were useless due to Hashi's, this is common.

Note: Lutenizing hormone In males, stimulates Leydig cell (testicles) production of testosterone.

Another note: Men with hashimoto's report poor absorption of testosterone creams and gels. This is due to myxedema. I have this problem and must use massive amounts of creme to get my T levels to 400. (4x the normal dose) Myxedema is a term used synonymously with severe hypothyroidism. It is also used to describe a dermatological change that can occur in hypothyroidism.

Here is what happens to me. At first the Testosterone gel, cream or patch works and my levels shoot up. I feel correct. Then within weeks, my skin gets really slimy feeling where the T is applied. And absorption stops. I can scrub until I'm raw and it's still slimy. That's myxedema and it's a problem. I hear that injections are the proper solution, however, I've not gone that route. Instead, I try what I can to enhance the creme's *effectivity by* by shaving my body and changing sites regularly. It's a royal pain.

Another point. A number of hashi patients are finding that B12 and other B vitamins are not being absorbed in the intestines. This is also part of the disease. I'm now anemic and use oral B12 in very high doses to get my levels correct. I can't predict what your condition will be, but I would not be surprised if, over time, you have the same problems.


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## davethyroid (Feb 20, 2015)

Thank you guys so much for taking the time to respond to me and set my mind at ease that I'm not suffering alone.

Here's a list of the supplements and medications I'm taking:

Fish oil

oral b12 (like you, my b12 was low despite taking a b complex vitamin. these help immensely with energy levels. )

selenium

2grain of armour

2000mg of metformin

vitamin d

vitamin b complex

biotin

optiferin

vitamin c

probiotic

zinc picolinate

benfotaimine

You have asked for my labs so here they are. My T levels look to be ok, but I'll let you guys tell me what you think.


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## fttfbass (Jan 8, 2014)

Your testerone levels look pretty good to me. I'd definitely be happy to have my levels where yours are. You're already aware of it, but your B12 is extremely low. Most people shoot for the top of the range for B12.

As far as thyroid goes, your Free T3 is still quite low in the range. You could definitely stand to increase your Armour until Free T3 is closer to 3.7 or so.

Unfortunately, I have no answer to your original question, but these are things that stuck out to me after looking at your labs.


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## cujet (Feb 6, 2015)

Cyanocobalamin is the typical B12. It does absolutely nothing for me. I don't absorb it orally, either under the tongue or swallowed. Methylcobalamin is what works. Even so, I must use oral spray 4 to 8 times the already absurd dose.


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## Octavia (Aug 1, 2011)

You might want to do a little research on pernicious anemia. (Then again, maybe you've already been diagnosed with it???)


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## cujet (Feb 6, 2015)

davethyroid,

On the subject of "T",

You do seem to have high levels. And, as I am sure you know, it's the Free T that does the work. Again, your levels look good. From what I've read, estradiol can be increased by certain gels and creams. It seems to be a "T" antagonist.

And, of course, every man responds differently to T. Some require more, some less. I'm happy with anything over 400-500.


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## cujet (Feb 6, 2015)

I simply wanted to add something I've noticed due to my lack of B12. If I drink a 5 hour energy drink (yes, I know, it's not ideal) I feel normal. Not hyper, not caffeinated up, but simply normal. It's the combo of the B vitamins and caffeine that works. And, that does positively improve my libido.

My crushing fatigue goes away, my muscles work again and I can do 3 sets at the gym, instead of two. It even clears up my thinking, from being unable to contemplate mathematical theorems. Those are my markers. Mental acuity and gym performance. I'm fairly sure it's due to a combo of glucose utilization and oxygen carrying capability.

In fact, nothing works as well as 5 hour energy. The alternatives without the high levels of B vitamins and with mucho sugar only make me shaky.


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## davethyroid (Feb 20, 2015)

That's fascinating. I do take oral b12 in the Methylcobalamin form. I've never tried a 5 hour energy drink, mostly because I'm not a huge fan of being reliant on caffeine and figured it contained chemicals that weren't the greatest. I will give it a try.

Thanks for letting me know the T levels are fine, hopefully I'll get to the bottom of this. I have another blood draw scheduled that I will post results from soon.


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## cujet (Feb 6, 2015)

davethyroid,

2000 metformin is an awful lot. That comes with it's own set of rather significant issues. As I'm sure you know, metformin just about stops B12 absorption.

How is your weight?

Also, do you work out at the gym?

My endocrinologist and I worked through my low insulin levels and the resulting out of control blood glucose. I have been an avid bicyclist forever, and I could ride and drive sugar levels down, but they'd come right back up. His suggestion was to go to the gym and lift weights, as much as I could stand. Build muscle. After 2 months of that, I suddenly felt human again and levels were perfect. They gym, proper nutrition and massive effort were required.

2 years later, I'm still doing very well. Especially now that I understand the B vitamin thing.

That's me on the left. It's an older pic, I now have more muscle!!


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## davethyroid (Feb 20, 2015)

I didn't know about the metformin and b12 issues...That's interesting and I'll definitely look into it.

I started taking the metformin because my fasting blood sugar levels were above 100.

When I first got hashimotos, I put on about 60 lbs in 6 months. Since then, I've really spend a lot of time working out and building muscle.

Before Hashi, 155 lbs, after, 220, now I'm back down to 170, but have quite a bit more muscle and less fat than when I was 155.

I work out about 4 times a week, quite a bit of weight training and HIIT. I'm actually in very good shape now, probably the best shape of my life.

I've continued to take metformin because it does seem to help with weight regulation. When I get off it, carbs wreak havoc on me. I.e. I'll put on 4 lbs from one meal, and not lose it like it's water weight.

Metformin completely controls that.

Perhaps my levels are low enough now that I can come off the metformin.

I had a blood draw this morning.

Results should be back in a week or so.


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## davethyroid (Feb 20, 2015)

Here's some more test results.. All of it looks pretty good to me.

Component Standard Range Your Value
*Testosterone, Total, LC/MS/MS (Quest) 250 - 1100 ng/dL 762 *
*Testosterone, Free (Quest) 46.0 - 224.0 pg/mL 75.3 *
*Testosterone,Bioavailable (Quest) 110.0 - 575.0 ng/dL 164.7 *
*Sex Hormone Binding Globulin (Quest) 10 - 50 nmol/L 50 *
*Albumin,Serum (Quest) 3.6 - 5.1 g/dL 4.8*

*Thyroid Peroxidase Antibodies (Quest) <9 IU/mL 81*

--This went down substantially....

*T3, Free (Quest) 2.3 - 4.2 pg/mL **2.9*

--Looks good

*Free T4, Automated 0.8 - 1.8 ng/dL 1.0*

--maybe a little low? Is this the same as T4?

Component Results

*White Blood Cell Count 3.8 - 10.8 Thousand/uL 4.2 *
*Red Blood Cell Count 4.20 - 5.80 Million/uL 4.48 *
*Hemoglobin 13.2 - 17.1 g/dL 14.0 *
*Hematocrit 38.5 - 50.0 % 41.3 *
*Mean Corpuscular Volume 80.0 - 100.0 fL 92.1 *
*Mean Corpuscular Hemoglobin 27.0 - 33.0 pg 31.3 *
*MCH Concentration 32.0 - 36.0 g/dL 34.0 *
*Red Cell Distribution Width-CV 11.0 - 15.0 % 13.0 *
*Platelet Count, Auto 140 - 400 Thousand/uL 226 *
*Mean Platelet Volume 7.5 - 11.5 fL 9.0 *
*Absolute Neut Count 1500 - 7800 cells/uL 1915 *
*Absolute Lymphocyte Count 850 - 3900 cells/uL 1558 *
*Absolute Mono Count 200 - 950 cells/uL 361 *
*Absolute Eos Count 15 - 500 cells/uL 336 *
*Absolute Baso Count 0 - 200 cells/uL 29 *
*Neutrophil Percent, Auto 45.6 *
*Lymphocyte Percent, Auto 37.1 *
*Monocyte Percent, Auto 8.6 *
*Eosinophil Percent, Auto 8.0 *
*Basophil Percent, Auto 0.7*

Any thoughts?


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## jenny v (May 6, 2012)

> *T3, Free (Quest) 2.3 - 4.2 pg/mL **2.9*
> 
> --Looks good
> 
> ...


I will comment on the above labs--both are low. The midpoint of the range for your Free T3 is 3.3, so you are not even close (and this is an important one as it plays a big part in your energy, metabolism, etc.). Your Free T4 midpoint is 1.3 so you're low, too.

What kind of thyroid medication are you taking? You definitely need a bump up.


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## cujet (Feb 6, 2015)

If my TSH were 2.0, I'd be completely non functional, in just about every way. I understand that's well within the "normal" range, but in my case, I need to fully suppress TSH to near zero. My other thyroid labs will then be in the normal/high normal range and I feel OK.

As a pilot, I have to keep my labs "normal" and I clearly have decades of experience with what works for me. I'd be guessing as to why. I only know that if I let my doc manage my thyroid levels by TSH, I'm useless, with horrible bouts of low blood sugar and difficult to control metabolism. Also, it's pretty clear that my intestines don't move food (even salads) through without higher thyroid levels.

It's a real battle, keeping levels where the FAA "needs" them, and being a functional human being.

I typically try to eat salads with fish. For some reason, that works for me. When I stray too far from that, I have trouble with reactive hypoglycemia.

All of which negatively impact my sex life.


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## davethyroid (Feb 20, 2015)

I realized I didn't post my TSH.

it's at 0.84.


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