# Eye Bulge - TED - Graves



## Deckah

_I am a 23/male/130-140lbs._

I recently got blood work done and I am awaiting results. I have no insurance and have been seeing a free clinic of OU physicians. :confused0064:

During the last two days my left eye seems to bulge out a bit 
and the upper/lower eyelids seem to be irritated along with swelling.
I can feel the difference between the two eyes, but I can't 
tell a difference when I look in the mirror (aside from the lid swelling). 
My vision stayed the same since this has happened. I think the right eye 
may also come along with the same thing since those eyelids seem to be 
swelling as well.

My vision has taken a dive overall (not due to last couple days), but it 
could just be due to my eyes taking strain and I might be just
mistaking that for impaired vision. I wear glasses at the computer, but 
take them off here and there. I also been using artificial tears around 
4x a day, even if there is no pain. I have been waking up sometimes with 
bloodshot eyes, but that goes away within 10 minutes. Though I did have a day just last week when I woke up with a nasty headache, this lasted for 2 hours.

I am almost *90%* sure I have a thyroid problem of some sort. I am really worried about my overall eye health. I don't want them to bulge out worse than it already is.

___________
~QUESTION~

I know overtime when the eye muscle/tissues are inflamed it seems they don't go back to their original form. Is there anyways to prevent this from happening? Or in some cases once medication is acquired, do they go back to their original form.

I was wondering if any anti inflammatory medications(*corticosteroid*/*amoxicillin*?) would alleviate this. I just want to bring up a medication and them see if I am fit to take it. I just don't want anything to mess up a thyroid med that I may get.

I was also reading over *Timolol* gel eye drops. Anyone heard of these?

*___________*

Hopefully I can figure out the proper levels I need to aim for and take some action. I have been feeling real depressed due to all of this. :sad0016:

_For anyone curious below is my symptoms_.

*I first noticed constant stuffy nose after being sick for 5 days. Then the fingers went. I Think the sickness sparked something up.*:sick0020:

*Overall symptoms*:
Hair falling out, head hair, eyebrows, eyelashes.
Fingernail ridges, flaking (on all fingers). Toes have 
it better than my fingernails (was only noticed on 4 toes).
Tiredness, overall weakness. Sinus problems, nasal drip, stuffy nose.
Eye vision getting worse. Ive noticed double vision a few times, pain 
in eyes sometimes, blood shot when I wake up some days. Eyelids are looser/plump.


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## Andros

Deckah said:


> _I am a 23/male/130-140lbs._
> 
> I recently got blood work done and I am awaiting results. I have no insurance and have been seeing a free clinic of OU physicians. :confused0064:
> 
> During the last two days my left eye seems to bulge out a bit
> and the upper/lower eyelids seem to be irritated along with swelling.
> I can feel the difference between the two eyes, but I can't
> tell a difference when I look in the mirror (aside from the lid swelling).
> My vision stayed the same since this has happened. I think the right eye
> may also come along with the same thing since those eyelids seem to be
> swelling as well.
> 
> My vision has taken a dive overall (not due to last couple days), but it
> could just be due to my eyes taking strain and I might be just
> mistaking that for impaired vision. I wear glasses at the computer, but
> take them off here and there. I also been using artificial tears around
> 4x a day, even if there is no pain. I have been waking up sometimes with
> bloodshot eyes, but that goes away within 10 minutes. Though I did have a day just last week when I woke up with a nasty headache, this lasted for 2 hours.
> 
> I am almost *90%* sure I have a thyroid problem of some sort. I am really worried about my overall eye health. I don't want them to bulge out worse than it already is.
> 
> ___________
> ~QUESTION~
> 
> I know overtime when the eye muscle/tissues are inflamed it seems they don't go back to their original form. Is there anyways to prevent this from happening? Or in some cases once medication is acquired, do they go back to their original form.
> 
> I was wondering if any anti inflammatory medications(*corticosteroid*/*amoxicillin*?) would alleviate this. I just want to bring up a medication and them see if I am fit to take it. I just don't want anything to mess up a thyroid med that I may get.
> 
> I was also reading over *Timolol* gel eye drops. Anyone heard of these?
> 
> *___________*
> 
> Hopefully I can figure out the proper levels I need to aim for and take some action. I have been feeling real depressed due to all of this. :sad0016:
> 
> _For anyone curious below is my symptoms_.
> 
> *I first noticed constant stuffy nose after being sick for 5 days. Then the fingers went. I Think the sickness sparked something up.*:sick0020:
> 
> *Overall symptoms*:
> Hair falling out, head hair, eyebrows, eyelashes.
> Fingernail ridges, flaking (on all fingers). Toes have
> it better than my fingernails (was only noticed on 4 toes).
> Tiredness, overall weakness. Sinus problems, nasal drip, stuffy nose.
> Eye vision getting worse. Ive noticed double vision a few times, pain
> in eyes sometimes, blood shot when I wake up some days. Eyelids are looser/plump.


Hello, Deckah!! Oh, boy..................it sounds like things are not well with you. I am so sorry. And it sure sounds suspiciously like thyroid problems w/ eye involvement.

When did you have the lab tests? Do you know if they ran any antibodies?

Please try to get copies of your labs so that you can start a folder and also so that you can post your results and ranges here if you like. We must have the ranges and different labs use different ranges.

In the meantime, I strongly urge you to get in to see an opthalmologist as there is much to be done to stave of the progression of the antibodies attacking the eyes. Treating the thyroid is essential but does little to treat the eyes at this point.

Meanwhile, cold packs on the eyes and continue using the moisturizing drops. Make sure you do not use drops w/ antihistamine as that makes the eyes worse. I like Refresh lubricating drops by day and lacrilube ointment by night.

Let us hear from you as soon as you get your labs in.


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## Deckah

The test was 5 days ago and I supposed to know here soon. Not sure if they ran any AB tests. I have genteal gel drops and equate tears that I can use. I don't like the gel drops cause they make my vision a bit blurry, but anything that helps.

I was on loratadine (antihistamine) prior to this happening. I finished out a 30 pill bottle about 3-4 weeks ago. Maybe I am getting late effects from it. The loratadine was for a nasal problem that I have and still have to this point. It didn't help :jumping0047:

Just a few hours ago I thought of using an ice pack and damn, wish I had known sooner (it feels soo calming). I think bright ideas strike me late. :sad0047:

*I would like to point out.* I do have 3 molars coming in (yeah my luck) during all this. Not sure what effect this would have on my eye, but I know way back I had a toothache that was causing earaches on and off. :confused0031:

I will report back as I get the results. Hopefully they test a wide-range of things. Id also like to know of any iron deficiencies.

Hopefully things will die down here soon. Or if things get worse I may just get the thyroid extracted and beat it with a baseball bat :anim_38:


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## Andros

Deckah said:


> The test was 5 days ago and I supposed to know here soon. Not sure if they ran any AB tests. I have genteal gel drops and equate tears that I can use. I don't like the gel drops cause they make my vision a bit blurry, but anything that helps.
> 
> I was on loratadine (antihistamine) prior to this happening. I finished out a 30 pill bottle about 3-4 weeks ago. Maybe I am getting late effects from it. The loratadine was for a nasal problem that I have and still have to this point. It didn't help :jumping0047:
> 
> Just a few hours ago I thought of using an ice pack and damn, wish I had known sooner (it feels soo calming). I think bright ideas strike me late. :sad0047:
> 
> *I would like to point out.* I do have 3 molars coming in (yeah my luck) during all this. Not sure what effect this would have on my eye, but I know way back I had a toothache that was causing earaches on and off. :confused0031:
> 
> I will report back as I get the results. Hopefully they test a wide-range of things. Id also like to know of any iron deficiencies.
> 
> Hopefully things will die down here soon. Or if things get worse I may just get the thyroid extracted and beat it with a baseball bat :anim_38:


Oh, wow! Your wisdom teeth? That can be painful.

Genteal and Equate is good. I personally don't care for the Genteal myself but everyone raves about it.

As you already know, we will be anxious to see those labs if you care to share and it is very important to include the ranges as different labs use different ranges.

Yes; Ice. Packages of frozen baby peas work really well.

Keep the baseball bat handy.


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## Gio111ca

Hi Andros, I know what you are feeling Deckah's.

Believe it or not, the SINGLE ONE thing that has greatly improved my vision has been the fact that I quit smoking (not sure if you are a smoker or not), in a very quick way.

I have always gotten up early (5AM) o work and use Visine drops, the ones for computer work, they work fine for me. I believe these are not suggested in the long run because they get the red out, but that is what I have until a better suggestion comes along. My eyes are tired mostly because I sit in front of a computer screen for at least 10 hours per day (its is now 8:37PM and I have been in front of a computer since 7AM). Not that I need a life, but I need my computer to work.

I just went for a blood test last Friday and will post my numbers here, they are dropping, I am on Tapazole 5mg.

Take care.


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## Andros

Gio111ca said:


> Hi Andros, I know what you are feeling Deckah's.
> 
> Believe it or not, the SINGLE ONE thing that has greatly improved my vision has been the fact that I quit smoking (not sure if you are a smoker or not), in a very quick way.
> 
> I have always gotten up early (5AM) o work and use Visine drops, the ones for computer work, they work fine for me. I believe these are not suggested in the long run because they get the red out, but that is what I have until a better suggestion comes along. My eyes are tired mostly because I sit in front of a computer screen for at least 10 hours per day (its is now 8:37PM and I have been in front of a computer since 7AM). Not that I need a life, but I need my computer to work.
> 
> I just went for a blood test last Friday and will post my numbers here, they are dropping, I am on Tapazole 5mg.
> 
> Take care.


You sound like you are doing really well and I am so glad to hear it. I am an ex-smoker!

Will be delighted to have a look at your lab results and ranges when you get them in.


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## Deckah

Thanks for the replies. Yes I am a smoker, but since my last post here I haven't had one. I smoked for about 3-4 years when younger, then stopped for about a year then started back up again. I was smoking around 2-4 cig a day, but now cold-turkey hopefully. It seems much easier to quit when I have a valid reason that's with me, than it was before. I just think of my thyroid and the cravings went down, but I am raiding my fridge. :anim_03:

Hopefully I can keep it up.

Also about the blood test results. Well they said, "3-5 days". It's been 8 days so I will give a call to the place this week. I'm not happy at all with that. :aim33:


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## Andros

Deckah said:


> Thanks for the replies. Yes I am a smoker, but since my last post here I haven't had one. I smoked for about 3-4 years when younger, then stopped for about a year then started back up again. I was smoking around 2-4 cig a day, but now cold-turkey hopefully. It seems much easier to quit when I have a valid reason that's with me, than it was before. I just think of my thyroid and the cravings went down, but I am raiding my fridge. :anim_03:
> 
> Hopefully I can keep it up.
> 
> Also about the blood test results. Well they said, "3-5 days". It's been 8 days so I will give a call to the place this week. I'm not happy at all with that. :aim33:


Tch; it's sad but true..............you will have to get on their backs for your lab results and ranges.

Glad you put down the ciggies. Good for you!

Chew gum.


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## Deckah

Well I called up there and got no test results back, instead they just stated on the phone that they could find nothing wrong with my test results. I am still going in for an appointment. Not sure what the issue is.

I was pretty sure and still am pretty sure that I have a thyroid problem of some kind. I just kind of doubt their ability to test for it now. I was pretty sure I would be referred to a endo doctor, but now it seems I am going to have to do it on my own. I don't know anymore. :anim_03:


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## Andros

Deckah said:


> Well I called up there and got no test results back, instead they just stated on the phone that they could find nothing wrong with my test results. I am still going in for an appointment. Not sure what the issue is.
> 
> I was pretty sure and still am pretty sure that I have a thyroid problem of some kind. I just kind of doubt their ability to test for it now. I was pretty sure I would be referred to a endo doctor, but now it seems I am going to have to do it on my own. I don't know anymore. :anim_03:


Deckah. If you can get a copy, please do so. I for one would like to know what tests were run, what the results were and the ranges are a must. Different labs use different ranges.

This is ridiculous. Why am I not surprised? Same thing has happened to me and thousands of others. And we pay for this!

I am also pretty sure you have a thyroid problem. I am also very very disappointed and I know you are as well.

Find out if they ran any of these tests......

The lab tests listed are helpful when it comes to sorting things out.

TSH, FREE T3, FREE T4, TPO (antimicrosomal antibodies), ANA (antinuclear antibodies), TSI (thyroid stimulating immunoglobulin) and Thyroglobulin Ab as well as thyroid binding inhibitory immunoglobulins (TBII.)

You can look all of the above up here so you know what they are for........
http://www.labtestsonline.org/


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## Deckah

I will follow through with the appointment and hopefully I have a doctor that sees things on my level and can somehow get back in for a proper test (I will bring up that list of things). If not I will asked to be referred to a endocrinologist.

I take it graves and the other thyroid diseases are all based off different acronyms like the above? Or was I just half-assed. :jumping0047:

Thanks for the reply


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## Andros

Deckah said:


> I will follow through with the appointment and hopefully I have a doctor that sees things on my level and can somehow get back in for a proper test (I will bring up that list of things). If not I will asked to be referred to a endocrinologist.
> 
> I take it graves and the other thyroid diseases are all based off different acronyms like the above? Or was I just half-assed. :jumping0047:
> 
> Thanks for the reply


Yes, they are. I do use acronyms but "usually" put in parentheses what they mean for we have many posters who are just starting out and trying to learn. This makes it easier for them; I hope.

Party on!!:anim_63:


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## Deckah

TSH (3rd gen) : 3.36

:sick0025::anim_63:

Well.

:jumping0047: Guess it's nice I finally got it.

I am trying to find a new clinic, but I will go back to the one I am currently going to even though I am just taking a step backwards. I just need to find a place that tests it all. :sad0016:

I got tested for mono just a few days ago which someone thought I had, but from what I hear mono clears within a few weeks to a month. Ive been sick for around 6 months(I forget) so that should had ruled that out. Anyways I was negative on mono, got bloodwork back and I didn't have it. So


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## Andros

Deckah said:


> TSH (3rd gen) : 3.36
> 
> :sick0025::anim_63:
> 
> Well.
> 
> :jumping0047: Guess it's nice I finally got it.
> 
> I am trying to find a new clinic, but I will go back to the one I am currently going to even though I am just taking a step backwards. I just need to find a place that tests it all. :sad0016:
> 
> I got tested for mono just a few days ago which someone thought I had, but from what I hear mono clears within a few weeks to a month. Ive been sick for around 6 months(I forget) so that should had ruled that out. Anyways I was negative on mono, got bloodwork back and I didn't have it. So


In my opinion, you are hypothyrod as AACE recommends the range for TSH to be 0.3 to 3.0. Canada says less.

I would feel horrid if my TSH was that high. Most of us feel best at one or less.

Yes; you do need to find a place to test it all. That would be most helpful to you.

How are you feeling???

It is very discouraging to not feel well and to have to advocate for one's self at the same time. We hope to be able to help you do that.

Hang in there and do actively seek out a place were you can get not only the TSH but the FREE T4 and FREE T3 as well as some of those antibodies listed.

Let me know if you need the antibodies' list again. I will provide it if you do.

Glad you did not have mono; who thought that you might have?


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## Deckah

One of the docs I went to. I was examined and he claimed I had an enlarged spleen. He examined me by touch :confused0064:

Anyways I feel fantastic except my hair is falling out and my eyes feel funky. To do that and be smiling at the same time makes me feel like I got something mentally wrong with me :jumping0047::anim_63:

I think I am developing chronic fatigue, but it varies by day. I have still not smoked since about a week and some days. I don't really crave that bad, which is weird. My fatigue is basically, "oh hey my eyes feel a bid heavy/tired, let me lay down for 3 minutes". Well I end up falling asleep for 3 hours then wake up, feel like **** with my eyes a bit dry, then 20min later I am back fully functional.

I think I just need to replace my batteries.

Anyways, is the TSH really all that bad? From the way you made it sound, I should be looking like E.T. by now.

Another thing about my eyes. They are pretty stagnant, the lids are still a bit swollen, but that is about it.


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## Deckah

I am a bit confused about TSH now. I got a reference range of "0.40-4.50 mIU/L".

I seen some other readings online stated under 5.0 while it seems endos recommend under 3.0?

If 3.0 is the case, I take it that a lot of people are getting screwed over and misdiagnosed a bunch of times. :anim_03: I can't begin to imagine how many people are depressed right now due to this. Then again I probably should had done my due-diligence before asking this question. Sorry :jumping0047:


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## Lovlkn

2nd opinion



> Anyways, is the TSH really all that bad? From the way you made it sound, I should be looking like E.T. by now.


YES! This is a bit high - with that range a TSH of 2 would be max of acceptable, for me anyway


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## Deckah

I called around 4 different endocrinologist clinics and 3 of which couldn't get an answer on my TSH, 1 of them said it was normal. Every single place I called would need me to be referred in. I guess it's a piggy-back system. :confused0031:

Anyways, I am going into a new lab to get a new blood test with all of the above done(thx andros). No halfassery this time :sick0025: I just got to wait 6 or so days until I get that done, then the wait for results. :sad0047:


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## Andros

Deckah said:


> One of the docs I went to. I was examined and he claimed I had an enlarged spleen. He examined me by touch :confused0064:
> 
> Anyways I feel fantastic except my hair is falling out and my eyes feel funky. To do that and be smiling at the same time makes me feel like I got something mentally wrong with me :jumping0047::anim_63:
> 
> I think I am developing chronic fatigue, but it varies by day. I have still not smoked since about a week and some days. I don't really crave that bad, which is weird. My fatigue is basically, "oh hey my eyes feel a bid heavy/tired, let me lay down for 3 minutes". Well I end up falling asleep for 3 hours then wake up, feel like **** with my eyes a bit dry, then 20min later I am back fully functional.
> 
> I think I just need to replace my batteries.
> 
> Anyways, is the TSH really all that bad? From the way you made it sound, I should be looking like E.T. by now.
> 
> Another thing about my eyes. They are pretty stagnant, the lids are still a bit swollen, but that is about it.


No, your TSH is not all that bad but clearly you do not feel well. And we are all different as well. Could be you have sort of adjusted to feeling poorly. Most of us have as thyroid disease can be insidious.

And also, your TSH implies hypothyroid but you did not have 
Free T4 or Free T3 nor any antibodies tests. It is very very possible for you to be hyperthyroid as well. The TSH does not always reflect what is "really" going on on a "stand alone" basis. The other tests are needed to get the whole picture.


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## Deckah

Alright I just got confirmation that the place I was going to use only does TSH/T3/T4 , so looks like back to the drawing board. :sick0026:

I didn't mention earlier, but I did have one thing on my test that was abnormal.

Absolute Monocytes: 1071 H Reference(200-950).

I didn't think it meant anything since they didn't bring it up, but it seems related to an infection that I could possibly have. I wasn't ill at the time of doing the test so I will bring it up with them. :confused0064:

Thanks for the previous replies. arty0006:


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## Andros

Deckah said:


> I am a bit confused about TSH now. I got a reference range of "0.40-4.50 mIU/L".
> 
> I seen some other readings online stated under 5.0 while it seems endos recommend under 3.0?
> 
> If 3.0 is the case, I take it that a lot of people are getting screwed over and misdiagnosed a bunch of times. :anim_03: I can't begin to imagine how many people are depressed right now due to this. Then again I probably should had done my due-diligence before asking this question. Sorry :jumping0047:


AACE New TSH Range Suggested By Endocrinology Association InFocus, Vol. 11, No. 1, March 2003

New clinical guidelines published by the American Association of Clinical Endocrinologists (AACE) suggest that the TSH level ranging from 0.5 to 5.0 to diagnose and treat patients with a thyroid disorder may be missing millions of Americans who suffer from a mild thyroid disorder but have gone untreated. Now the AACE encourages physicians to consider treatment for patients who test outside the boundaries of a narrower margin based on a target TSH level of 0.3 to 3.0

http://www.aarda.org/infocus_article.php?ID=8


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## Andros

Deckah said:


> Alright I just got confirmation that the place I was going to use only does TSH/T3/T4 , so looks like back to the drawing board. :sick0026:
> 
> I didn't mention earlier, but I did have one thing on my test that was abnormal.
> 
> Absolute Monocytes: 1071 H Reference(200-950).
> 
> I didn't think it meant anything since they didn't bring it up, but it seems related to an infection that I could possibly have. I wasn't ill at the time of doing the test so I will bring it up with them. :confused0064:
> 
> Thanks for the previous replies. arty0006:


Absolute Monocytes can be elevated in immune mediated disease and of course, Autoimmune thyroid would be one of many. Or you could simply have an infection of some sort.

You can read all about them here.....
http://www.labtestsonline.org/understanding/analytes/differential/test.html

Did your doctor comment about the monocytes?

Do you have any family members with autoimmune disease such as thyroid, lupus, arthritis, diabetes etc../


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## Deckah

Seems like I am getting closer once again arty0006:

No mention of the monocytes from the doctor. I will make sure to bring that up next time (appt:tuesday - could be my last time there, then off to a different clinic).

No thyroid disorders as far as I know. I will give a call to my parents later on though and about the other disorders. They are puzzled as well am I. :confused0033:


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## Andros

Deckah said:


> Seems like I am getting closer once again arty0006:
> 
> No mention of the monocytes from the doctor. I will make sure to bring that up next time (appt:tuesday - could be my last time there, then off to a different clinic).
> 
> No thyroid disorders as far as I know. I will give a call to my parents later on though and about the other disorders. They are puzzled as well am I. :confused0033:


Hmmmmmmmmmmmm; I am glad you are going to delve into the family medical history. That should be interesting and bear in mind that in days of yore, our grandparents and great grandparents often died of unknown or undiagnosed causes.

You would think the doctor would at least broach the subject of increased monocytes? Yes? No? Geez!


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