# Thyroid related?



## Chromatic (Mar 31, 2011)

I have spent the better part of the last 4+ years suffering daily because I cannot figure out what is wrong with me.

I'll try to be as brief as possible.

My mother is hypothyroid, unsure of age of diagnosis.

My own symptoms : (I am a 32yr old male)

*Vision* abnormalities -- can't focus properly, see starbursts, halos, blurry, like a film is over my eyes.. tracking problems etc. Though I have perfect visual acuity, so not sure where to go there.

*Pain* -- Essentially from the base of my skull down my spine into my pelvis. Some spots hurts generally all the time, some on and off.

*Weakness* -- Everything feels weak. Like it is hard to hold my head up, everything is an effort.

*Sinuses* -- Chronic, every day, no idea why.

*Headache* -- but that has fallen on the back burner because of more severe symptoms.

*Brain fog!* -- I can't think straight, ever! Combined with the vision problems it makes life very hard. I forget why I entered a room, open wrong cabinets and immediately realize it, etc.

*Joints* feel like they swell, but ANA and RA factor have come back negative. Generally feel stiff, especially neck.

*Tired* -- just no get up and go. If I eat often even if I am sitting just doing the simplest computer task I will need to get up and lay down for 30 minutes (not sleeping, just resting).

*Insomnia* -- This is plagued me for a long time.

*Hoarse and Weak Voice* -- Just as the title says,.. my voice is 80% of the time incredibly hoarse and weak. It is an effort to speak for any length of time, and the more I do so the weaker/more hoarse it gets. I do have chronic sinuses (may be from allergies, I have no clue) that could be contributing.. but this seems a little more than post nasal drip, imo.

*Psychological* - It goes without saying I have an abnormal amount of anxiety.. and of course the GP's want to push things to a "your depressed, and thats why you have anxiety, and that is causing all your problems." I just don't buy it. *I've tried several anti-depressants and they just don't help me.* With seemingly no answers and no real effort to help from the doctors I do see,.. I really feel hopeless alot of times. If a doctor doesn't know what to do, it is disheartening.

Might as well mention it: Spine, shoulder girdle, and so on pop way more than they should. Sometimes the pops hurt, sometimes not. Just abnormal. (Always feel tight , especially from head to hips, on backside)

I am not losing weight, and if anything may have gained a little weight, (I am not under weight.. but not overweight). I say this because I thought if you were hyper you would have a really hard time of putting on weight?

The doctor has run several labs over the last 2 years.. and I don't think he realizes how much this effects me, but that is a moot point here.

Only results he ever reported to me was a low vitamin D level. It was 14, out of a range of 32-100.

I recently got my records and I discovered there are quite a few labs that were abnormal but just 'slightly'.. so I anticipate when the nurses say all is fine that since they were close it is ok. However I had to ask him to run a thyroid check my last visit.

He said he was running a comprehensive Thyroid panel.

The results were only one check.. the TSH level (I don't believe this is *comprehensive*). Which I know is a good first step, but he ordered a $250 Vitamin D check, why not a full T3/T4 etc check as well? Again, moot point here.

But the TSH level was 0.24 with a reference of 0.490 - 4.670

There was absolutely no mention of this to me. The nurses said when I called and had to ask -- 'all tests were normal'.. Oh except my cholesterol is high. So they said take fish oil.

I'm having a conundrum here -- What is the point of reference ranges if I am .24 and LOW if that is just acceptable?

From my little research I understand that hyperthyroidism is generally nearly zero TSH. More like 0.1 or undetectable. But does .24 not warrant further exploration, or is it normal just to ignore it and deem it as 'close enough' ?

I always thought I could possibly be hypo,.. but hyper never crossed my mind?

Just wanted you basic opinions, questions, and so on regarding my symptoms (there are more, but you know how listing all of them goes..) my results (TSH),.. the lack of action and so on?

This is an Internal Medicine PCP/GP primary care doctor.

Being so weak, having this unbelievable brain fog all the time, etc.. what should be my next move?

I'm obviously not happy with how things have gone so far, and I am disgruntled with GP's in general. The few I've seen really seem to be very ignorant. They just don't know much,... but I digress.

Anyhow,.. does this warrant further investigation ? Any ideas/thoughts?

If I were to go see another doctor -- (My insurance allows me to see any specialist booking it myself, no referral needed) -- should I see a rheumy? Or specifically see an endocrinologist?

I'm not sure which would be more likely to figure out the problem. If I see the endo then they should be very good with thyroid issues, but will they lack skills if there is autoimmune processes going on otherwise? Likewise for a rheumy -- would they likely miss a firm diagnosis on thyroid issues?

I can already say after 2 GP's .. GP's can definitely miss just about any diagnosis =/

Thanks for your help,

Chromatic

P.S. -- I am going to post some further labs (more metabolic and such) in the labs section so if you'd like to see other lab results that may or may not relate to thyroid issues you can check there.

Thanks again!


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## midgetmaid (Jul 22, 2010)

I would see an endocrinologist. Then if thyroid is ruled out, a rheumatologist. One of my symptoms was weakness, especially the back. I felt like I couldn't hold myself up straight and had to lay down a lot.

Renee


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## Andros (Aug 26, 2009)

Chromatic said:


> I have spent the better part of the last 4+ years suffering daily because I cannot figure out what is wrong with me.
> 
> I'll try to be as brief as possible.
> 
> ...


I think you are Hyperthyroid! I really do! For that reason, I suggest TSI lab test and RAIU (radioactive uptake scan.) The latter because men are more prone to thyroid cancer and hyper and cancer are often found together

Also antibodies' tests are imperative.

TSI
Normally, there is no TSI in the blood. If TSI is found in the blood, this indicates that the thyroid stimulating immunoglobulin is the cause of the of a person's hyperthyroidism. 
http://www.medicineonline.com/topics/t/2/Thyroid-Stimulating-Immunoglobulin/TSI.html

TSI (thyroid stimulating immunoglobulin),TPO (antimicrosomal antibodies) TBII (thyrotropin-binding inhibitory immunoglobulin), Thyroglobulin Ab, ANA (antinuclear antibodies), (thyroid hormone panel) TSH, Free T3, Free T4.

You can look this stuff up here and more.........
http://www.labtestsonline.org/

(GED/TED)
http://www.caleyes.com/webdocuments/...ease_paper.pdf

men more likely to have cancer than women
http://www.umm.edu/endocrin/thytum.htm

Antibodies down regulate vitamin D.................; here is why.
Vitamin D
http://www.eurekalert.org/pub_releases/2009-04/arf-vdm040809.php

I have been reading all your posts and have enjoyed every single one except for this one. Something is going on; absolutely!

And it is important for you to read this; don't like what is going on w/your throat and such. 
Thyroid cancer symptoms
http://www.cityofhope.org/patient_care/treatments/thyroid-cancer/Pages/symptoms.aspx

Since thyroid disease is almost always autoimmune; yes..............the sinus' go nuttso. Your body cannot fight off foreign invaders.

Hope I did not overwhelm you with info. I don't think I did. Something tells me that you are one smart cookie. LOL!!

I am aghast @ $250 for a Vitamin D lab. OMG!!!


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## CA-Lynn (Apr 29, 2010)

See an endocrinologist, then a rheumatologist.

As far as anti-depressants go: they really don't work well without one-on-one talk therapy. So find a good psychologist [not a psychiatrist] and have a few talk sessions AFTER the endocrinologist and rheumatologist have ruled out any problems.


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## Chromatic (Mar 31, 2011)

midgetmaid said:


> I would see an endocrinologist. Then if thyroid is ruled out, a rheumatologist. One of my symptoms was weakness, especially the back. I felt like I couldn't hold myself up straight and had to lay down a lot.
> 
> Renee


Thanks, I can't seem to find any disease or problem, or group of people that have my exact specific problems. That weakness of this nature can be a sign of thyroid problem is encouraging that maybe I am on the right track.

My weakness is also in my eyes -- I feel like I need to just close them and reading or really just keeping them open for very long tires them out very quickly. I don't remember the last time my eyes felt 'right', acted right.. or comfortable. But to the best of my ability my eyes don't look bug-eyed or bulging.. but the lids , especially lower lid is/are very swollen all the time. Allergies? Thyroid related? I don't know really.

Thanks for the comment.


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## Chromatic (Mar 31, 2011)

Andros said:


> I think you are Hyperthyroid! I really do! For that reason, I suggest TSI lab test and RAIU (radioactive uptake scan.) The latter because men are more prone to thyroid cancer and hyper and cancer are often found together


I hope you are right,.. because I've been searching for an answer to help my situation for years now and right now I *want* a diagnosis so I can treat things. People often think .. oh the doctor said this or that test was negative isn't that wonderful? And I just think.. well, yes, and no. I have the most god awful symptoms which effect my life dramatically so at this point I want the test to be positive so we can get on with things and start some treatment so I can just feel half way normal again.

I hope that doesn't sound crazy!

You say you think I am hyperthyroid -- well,..

As I was trying to get across in my long post (I have fairly lengthy when I write...) --

Was , since my level is 0.24 TSH does that indicate anything? Would most doctors say that is normal for someone like myself (who isn't on medicine obviously?) -- Or is it low enough that it likely means something is going on and more testing needs to be done.

That is the thing I can't wrap my head around. Because as I said before, what is the point of having a low end of the range if it doesn't matter if you are considerably below it as is my case?

Why not just say, you are 'normal' unless your TSH is under 0.1 or something?

Does the hyper, which I know seems not to be as prevalent as hypo -- just not apply for different ranges?

I've noticed that people can be in the 0.3 to 3 range and by hypo,.. But if someone is out of that range , towards the low side they are probably not hyper?

Clarification would be nice. If it is something the doctor should have looked into instead of his nurses just saying all is normal.. then I need to know so I can push for action see another doctor and so on. If it is 99% just normal and the ranges don't mean much on the low end, then I need to know that as well.

**The above goes to anyone reading, not just whom I'm quoting! 



> Also antibodies' tests are imperative.


I've had none of those tests except for the ANA -- which came back negative. Obviously the doctor finally took my recommendation after 2 years to run a thyroid check and as most doctors do just checked TSH. Then saw it at 0.2 and deemed it normal. And maybe it is??

But for the antibody tests.. thanks for the information -- anyone can run these tests or order them. I'm just torn whether to see an endocrinologist or rheumotologist initially. Because a rheumy is the autoimmune specialist and what is going on with me definitely feels autoimmune. What else can give the mental brain fog/difficulty and general systemic problems that isn't autoimmune.

Sure I can see both.. but money doesn't grow on tree's.. and everytime I see a doctor and get no answers it really , for some reason, is rough on me emotionally. I don't break down and cry, etc.. but I just feel defeated because I'm seeking help.



> Antibodies down regulate vitamin D.................; here is why.
> Vitamin D
> http://www.eurekalert.org/pub_releases/2009-04/arf-vdm040809.php


I did not know this.. though I did/do know vitamin D is responsible for MANY disease processes.. most autoimmune, MS, cancers, etc. It seems to be our single best and worst enemy as far as vitamins go and disease progression/modification and prevention are concerned.



> I have been reading all your posts and have enjoyed every single one except for this one. Something is going on; absolutely!


Thank you! I'm glad they aren't too long for everyone and they are comprehensible. 



> And it is important for you to read this; don't like what is going on w/your throat and such.
> Thyroid cancer symptoms


I always thought thyroid problems were known to cause hoarse voice and even weakness. This is one of the symptoms , i thought? Am I wrong?



> Since thyroid disease is almost always autoimmune; yes..............the sinus' go nuttso. Your body cannot fight off foreign invaders.


My nose is always swollen shut and has mucous in it (gross I know) -- doesn't matter what I do it keeps happening everyday when I wake up, along with eyes stuck shut, and the eyes having no tears in them and being extremely red due to this. Feels like sand is in them when I lay down to go to sleep (like the eyes are rubbing against the eyelids.. ) like all my tears drain out because of laying on my back. Then by the morning they are really in trouble. (I think this is the reason for some of my eye distortion/blurryness etc.) -- I think the other eye problems have something to do with muscle weakness .. ie: convergence insufficiency or something similar.

But if the eye muscle problems are due to some autoimmune process I don't want to start a 3 thousand dollar eye therapy course because that would be a waste of money simply because the problem wouldn't be treated due to the underlying cause.



> Hope I did not overwhelm you with info. I don't think I did. Something tells me that you are one smart cookie. LOL!!
> 
> I am aghast @ $250 for a Vitamin D lab. OMG!!!


No you certainly did not. In fact I devour information, especially if it relates to what 'may' help me get better. So feel free to overwhelm me as much as possible. I do appreciate it!

Yes, my bloodtests are all from "LabCorp" which I think is nationwide -- I guess they are reliable.

Again thanks for the reply, lots of great info!


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## Chromatic (Mar 31, 2011)

CA-Lynn said:


> See an endocrinologist, then a rheumatologist.
> 
> As far as anti-depressants go: they really don't work well without one-on-one talk therapy. So find a good psychologist [not a psychiatrist] and have a few talk sessions AFTER the endocrinologist and rheumatologist have ruled out any problems.


Yes, that seems to be the advice of most -- I anticipated this of course. I came here with the only other test result that was uniquely abnormal, and it happened to be thyroid. I am just on the fence whether it means anything at all because the doctor obviously didn't say anything about it being low.

As for the psyche --

I've seen a psychiatrist, and two different psychologists.. had several months of 'talk therapy' (at 185$ per 45 minutes) -- was the best there was supposedly.

I was concurrently on medication.. an SSRI as well.

Just speaking from my experience, talk therapy does me no good.

The reason for this is because when I am in with the therapist there is no 'cause' for my feelings, for what is wrong emotionally. There is nothing that I think about that is traumatic. Other than my parents divorcing when I was 4 yrs old there is nothing more they can dig at.. and it always leads to my father not being around. I understand that probably had some effect on me.. I was completely fine physically and mentally for 25 good years of my life. Then from 26-32 it has been a nightmare? Nothing suddenly happened..

I give people the same advice -- to get talk therapy with medication because it is generally scientifically proven to be most effective in conjunction. However, medication does work for some people alone, and talk therapy 'alone' works for some. There is no hard fact that they must be in conjunction to work. There are studies that show the efficiency of therapy + medication to be the greatest of course.

If talk therapy, or any medication would fix or help me -- I'm game. I really am. But I've been there and done that.. and probably will be there again undoubtedly as things aren't found out.

I feel like this mystery illness case that no one can figure out (even though I haven't had that many tests or been to that many doctors ) -- and I feel alone because I have no one I can relate to with my specific complaints.

It isn't easy, but I don't seek sympathy or pity -- just logical answers. We know when something is wrong with our body and minds physically. You know your body better than anyone else. This is a conviction I can't ignore that something is really wrong with me.. beyond bringing me out of some depressive state etc.

I appreciate your comment(s) -- and I agree with your recommendation, just had to add my take on the medication and talk therapy route. I wish there were better treatments. But due to the ineffectiveness of half a dozen different anti depressants and thousands of dollars of talk therapy that did nothing but break the bank I can only logically assume that a physiological problem just isn't going to be treated with psychological therapy. Just like a psychological problem wouldn't be properly treated with therapies intended for physiological problems. etc.

I mean no offense, or ill will/tone with this reply.. please don't take it negatively. I really do appreciate any and all responses!

Take care ,


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## Andros (Aug 26, 2009)

Chromatic said:


> Thanks, I can't seem to find any disease or problem, or group of people that have my exact specific problems. That weakness of this nature can be a sign of thyroid problem is encouraging that maybe I am on the right track.
> 
> My weakness is also in my eyes -- I feel like I need to just close them and reading or really just keeping them open for very long tires them out very quickly. I don't remember the last time my eyes felt 'right', acted right.. or comfortable. But to the best of my ability my eyes don't look bug-eyed or bulging.. but the lids , especially lower lid is/are very swollen all the time. Allergies? Thyroid related? I don't know really.
> 
> Thanks for the comment.


Weakness........................myopathy.
http://www.medicalonly.com/2007/07/27/thyrotoxicmyopathy_hyperthyroidism

Eye info.............
http://www.caleyes.com/webdocuments/...ease_paper.pdf

At this time, it would be very wise to see an ophthalmologist to establish a "baseline" so that any movement can be detected. Also, it depends on the person's facial structure. Not all globes are able to exit the orbits and will take the pathway of least resistance. Aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaargh. MRI is helpful when this is suspected.


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## Atreya (Jan 30, 2011)

Hi, Chromatic, i feel very like you describe. i am also under a very big depression and anxiety, i barely can do a normal life. i think that you are under a Hiper process, or sth is going on. i don't know if blame the thyroid of my all symptoms, i have gone with several specialists, and again it seems the thyroid creating all the symptoms.


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## Chromatic (Mar 31, 2011)

Andros said:


> Weakness........................myopathy.
> http://www.medicalonly.com/2007/07/27/thyrotoxicmyopathy_hyperthyroidism


Didn't know about the toxicity. It really sounds very familiar to a process that occurs with Myasthenia Gravis, which is autoimmune and attacks the neuromuscular junction causing weakness. In much the same locations , proximal limbs, eyes, etc.



> Eye info.............
> http://www.caleyes.com/webdocuments/...ease_paper.pdf


My eyes don't seem to 'bulge' out to me, is this a pre-requisite?



> At this time, it would be very wise to see an ophthalmologist to establish a "baseline" so that any movement can be detected. Also, it depends on the person's facial structure. Not all globes are able to exit the orbits and will take the pathway of least resistance. Aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaargh. MRI is helpful when this is suspected.


Well I have seen a few eye doctors.. as I mentioned, of no help so far which is to be expected if it is a result of autoimmune or not quite so 'common' processes, given the complaints I go in with.

At any rate,.. I did have an MRI at my last visit with my PCP because of my double vision (I have monocular double vision, and transient binocular.. esp when tired). So I suppose that MRI (which I have on CD) is a good reference , base point for this point?

Though looking at the MRI it would be hard for me to tell if the eyes or muscles are in an abnormal way. And I doubt the radiologist who was looking for abnormalities of the brain would notice 'somewhat' subtle variations in the orbitals/eyes. Still good to have. If someone else would be able to make any sense of things I can post images easy, give me the slice you want to see.  But again, this is at minimum a reference point.

Eyes on MRI's look like bug eyes anyway =)


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## Chromatic (Mar 31, 2011)

Atreya said:


> Hi, Chromatic, i feel very like you describe. i am also under a very big depression and anxiety, i barely can do a normal life. i think that you are under a Hiper process, or sth is going on. i don't know if blame the thyroid of my all symptoms, i have gone with several specialists, and again it seems the thyroid creating all the symptoms.


Atreya,

While I'm glad someone can really relate to me, at the same time it makes me sad because if you truly do experience what I do I know how bad you feel, and how frustrated you are.

Yes I , as well, as I think anyone would succumb to -- suspect anxiety (both produced by thyroid related processes and general psychology) is exacerbating symptoms and there is some existing depression due to the condition(s) and how it is effecting our lives .. ie: Situational depression, etc.

If you have gone to several specialists and they are implicating your thyroid, I would continue pushing for the best treatment of your thyroid condition based on the level of improvement of symptoms (or lack of).. but that is just me.

Thanks,


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## Thyroidmommy (Mar 25, 2011)

Chromatic said:


> *Vision* abnormalities -- can't focus properly, see starbursts, halos, blurry, like a film is over my eyes.. tracking problems etc. Though I have perfect visual acuity, so not sure where to go there.
> 
> *** UGH!! The eye thing.... This is the one major problem that affects my life greatly! The only way I can explain it is a silent migrane allthough most usual it is followed by a headache. It is a MAJOR nuisance! I have been reading alot about TED thyroid eye disease and really wonder if this is what plauges me??? I don't have buldging eyes either. Excedrin is my best friend it seems to be the only thing that helps.
> 
> ...


I have hashimotos and have been on thyroid medication for a few years while many of my symptoms have greatly improved the eye thing still greatly bothers me along with the headaches. I don't know wht causes it for sure and can't give you answers just a :hugs: to let you know your not alone.


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## Steal_My_Skin (Mar 18, 2011)

Hi, Chromatic. I'm sorry to hear about how you're feeling and the ringer that the GPs are putting you through.

I was recently diagnosed with Graves' and many of your symptoms sound quite familiar to what I've felt, though I would say mine have been milder for the most part. The pain, the eyes not bulging but also not working quite right, the fog, the headaches, and oh the psychological issues.

Like you, I had to go through a series of GPs to get to the root of it. One dermatologist randomly checked my TSH and told me it was three tenths of a point below range (so yes, those reference ranges matter!), but I didn't pursue further testing because at that time I thought I was fine. Ultimately I got my answer after the thyroid gave me a humming bird heart rate and other un-ignorable gastrointestinal symptoms. I saw a new doctor and told her how many people in my family have thyroid disease. With my family history and my very obvious metabolic symptoms, there wasn't much room for debate aside from, "which arm are we drawing the blood from?"

I think you should see an endocrinologist, or go to a GP that you have vetted. With websites like Yelp and HealthGrades, you can get an idea whether or not the prospective doctor is the type who will hear you out.

Another option is self-diagnosis, which many doctors frown upon but sometimes is the only way to get anything done. DirectLabs.com is offers low cost lab tests without a doctor's orders. You pay through DirectLabs.com, make an appointment at a legitimate LabCorp lab near you, and get your test. Best part? Results are posted online within a few DAYS. I used DirectLabs at the height of an undiagnosed thyroid crisis where my doctor refused to even talk to me unless I paid $100 for a repeat office visit during which she was going to re-test my liver enzymes. I didn't want to repeat the test without simultaneously running other tests to determine the underlying cause of my issues. My GP didn't understand this sentiment. So I said, in MUCH more colorful language, "Well, I suspect it's Hepatitis, so I'm going to find a way to get tested for Hepatitis." It wasn't viral Hepatitis (probably just elevated liver enzymes due to the thyroid madness), but DirectLabs allowed me to find that out within THREE DAYS (rather than the 2 weeks my GP took to report results to me), and for only $200. Mind you, Hepatitis panels are expensive.

Anyway, enough of that. Point is, find a way to get your questions answered. It is your right to know why you're feeling this way. If you think you know what is causing the problems, you've done a significant amount of the doctor's work already. A bad doctor will feel threatened or annoyed by this. You no longer have time to mess with bad doctors. Find a good one who will respect your concerns and order the dang blood tests. You'd think the microscope slides and test strips they're using are made of solid gold. YEESH!


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## Chromatic (Mar 31, 2011)

Steal_My_Skin said:


> Hi, Chromatic. I'm sorry to hear about how you're feeling and the ringer that the GPs are putting you through.


Thank you for the empathy.. I'm constantly torn between being self convicted there is a major systemic problem going on the doctor hasn't figured out yet.. to well, I guess I'm just nuts and the negative results prove that. arghh! 



> I was recently diagnosed with Graves' and many of your symptoms sound quite familiar to what I've felt, though I would say mine have been milder for the most part. The pain, the eyes not bulging but also not working quite right, the fog, the headaches, and oh the psychological issues.


My symptoms have crept up over the past 5 years or so.. and they have ever so slowly gotten worse it seems. Though there seem to be better and worse 'periods' but the 'better periods' are still very much not acceptable.

The brain fog and vision really get to me -- because I am not an idiot .. am quite intelligent but it is incredibly frustrating to feel like you are stumbling through the day spaced out and just scattered. Further the psychological aspect is rough. I feel like I am just dead tired all the time and can't focus but at the same time 'jumpy' -- which feels like anxiety and I'm sure alot of it is.. but it is an uncomfortable feeling to say the least --



> Like you, I had to go through a series of GPs to get to the root of it. One dermatologist randomly checked my TSH and told me it was three tenths of a point below range (so yes, those reference ranges matter!), but I didn't pursue further testing because at that time I thought I was fine. Ultimately I got my answer after the thyroid gave me a humming bird heart rate and other un-ignorable gastrointestinal symptoms. I saw a new doctor and told her how many people in my family have thyroid disease. With my family history and my very obvious metabolic symptoms, there wasn't much room for debate aside from, "which arm are we drawing the blood from?"


I feel like I have been to a million doctors, but really only two technically.. and really only pursued my current GP actively with testing and such.

As for the TSH -- well, .3 tenths of a point is about where I am I would assume. With a reference range of .5 to roughly 5 -- and my result being .24 -- that is right at 3 tenths. When you get into the hyper.. the low end is less than .5 tenths of a point total. I don't know whether to think a .2 level is 'low', because I see most hyper's reporting numbers like .0001 or some other just completely obvious result.

That is my problem is I 'look' fairly normal. I don't have any overtly unignorable easily tested symptom -- like the heart rate. My temperature is always a degree or so 'low'.. and my heart rate falls on the upper end of the 'normal range' -- usually 88-100bpm.. but I can attribute that to not enough cardiovascular exercise etc.. Point is unless a specific test is done there hasn't , thus far, been any overtly sign that points to a problem. Which is incredibly , incredibly frustrating.

People will comment isn't it great that your results were negative.. and yes, I don't want anything but at the same time.. with my quality of life and symptoms I want to figure out something. That is the difference.. if things are significantly effecting your quality of life and you are being tested you expect a result telling you why. If you aren't being very much impacted and get back negative results you are just very happy there is nothing that is going to effect you in the future.

I am glad to hear you got the results you needed though .. and I hope I am either miraculously cured soon or something explains what is up!



> I think you should see an endocrinologist, or go to a GP that you have vetted. With websites like Yelp and HealthGrades, you can get an idea whether or not the prospective doctor is the type who will hear you out.


Thanks for the references to the websites.. I will have to check them out. I guess I just have to randomly pick names and see if they have reports -- I've wanted to see a 'review' site with doctors from my area to maybe help me pick .. instead of just "throwing darts" per se.



> Another option is self-diagnosis,


I've done an incredible amount of self-diagnosis and medical research over the years this has effected me. I am speaking of the thyroid because it is just one test result that points to a potential reason.. but there are several other possibilities so to speak and I'm sure , as I've learned through research, that I have no idea really exist. But I appreciate the labs info and that it is , at least, a possibility. I may do this on some specific 'self diagnostic ideas' just to sort of clear the slate. Depends on cost of course. The two main at the moment are thyroid and myasthenia gravis -- My pain doesn't really make any sense with any disease other than a polyarthritic type,.. and if that were going on you would think my ANA, RF, or SED rate would have really pointed to it.



> Anyway, enough of that. Point is, find a way to get your questions answered. It is your right to know why you're feeling this way. If you think you know what is causing the problems, you've done a significant amount of the doctor's work already. A bad doctor will feel threatened or annoyed by this. You no longer have time to mess with bad doctors. Find a good one who will respect your concerns and order the dang blood tests. You'd think the microscope slides and test strips they're using are made of solid gold. YEESH!


I really appreciate this reply -- I feel you sort of have, unfortunately, been through a similar predicament and found success in the end.

Yes, I have done ALOT of the work for doctors -- thing is there are quite a few possibilities.. and as you say doctors feel threatened,.. and if they aren't threatened they will likely write you off as a hypochondriac , or mentally ill and not take your 'ideas' seriously. I have yet to go in and say look doc, I have done my own homework and think I may have either this , this or this.. I've just presented symptoms and let him go with it. The last test was an MRI because of my 'brain fog' and vision.. which was without contrast and was normal. Yes, I am glad it was normal.. but it is yet another costly thing that isn't *helping* me. It only helps in ruling out some things.. and allowing the doctor to run out of ideas I suppose. 

Thanks for the reply -- and advice. If I had the doctor I knew would take me seriously and give me the confidence I need I'd be there today! I don't mind if it takes someone a while to figure out things, I've been dealing with it for years.. I just want someone who won't quit and may not be intimidated or biased with such a broad list of symptoms.

Take care,


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