# Grrrrrrrr! Labs and a vent



## nvsmom (Sep 30, 2012)

I had one of _*those*_ appointments today where all I want to do now is find my doctor's car so I can egg it.  Grrr. I'll tell you about it in a moment.

Today's appointment was just a check on my labs. I'm posting all of my labs from this fall below because I've only been recognized and treated as hypo since the late summer. I had my TSH checked when I found out I was a celiac because I knew the two diseases are often linked. I'm hoping you all can offer me advice or see any trends I'm missing.

July 20, 2012
TSH = 14.27 ______ (ref range 0.20-6.00)

August 2, 2012 (had taken no meds yet)
TPO Ab = 33.8 _____ (0.0-34.0)
TSH = 13.42 ______ (0.20-6.00)
Free T4 = 11.6 ______ (10.0-25.0)

October 9, 2012 (after ~7 weeks on 50 mcg Synthroid)
TSH = 7.55 ______ (0.20-6.0)
Free T4 = 15.3 ______ (10.0-25.0)
Total T3 = 1.3 ______ ( 1.1-2.8)

*Two weeks after starting on synthroid I felt horrible. My hair fell out like never before, I was deeply fatigued, feverish and flu-like, got mouth ulcers, and bad arthritic like pains in my hands and elbows. I suspected Lupus (still waiting to get into a rheumatologist) but it could have been my body adjusting to the hormones... who knows. It's improved now... I'm just balder with stiff weak joints.:sad0049:

November 26, 2012 (after ~ 7 weeks on 75 mcg Synthroid)
TSH = 5.86 ______ (0.20-6.00)
Free T4 = 14.3 ______ (10.0-25.0)
Total T3 1.3 ______ (1.1-2.8)

I went into the appointment knowing that I was going to ask for Natural Desicated Thyroid of some type because I don't feel better. In fact I have felt quite a bit worse over the last 4 months. Every hypo symptom I had prior to treatment has been magnified except for constipation but that could be related to my gluten-free diet for celiac disease. If I could go back to how I felt with a TSH in the teens, I would do so GLADLY.

I had also had come to realize that my lips are swollen in the morning after taking my pill in the wee hours of the morning. At first I thought it was a food allergy like milk or nuts so I cut them out, but then it dawned on me that the only thing new these past months was the Synthroid...

Anyway, when I got to the appointment, he was going through my labs and he declared me *normal* because my TSH was within range at* 5.86*. I told him that I still feel no better, and that things like my hair loss was worse. I told him about my other symptoms. I told him about my swelling lips and mouth.... He just went on about how Synthroid is EXACTLY the same as my body's hormones, and is all I need, so it can't possibly be causing the reaction; it was a coincidence and the hair loss was probably due to some other disease like alopecia areata (not that he said anything about treating the coincidental diseases). :scared0011:

I was dumbfounded and getting upset so I argued with him that according to the labs, I wouldn't be hyper until my TSH was 0.20 so there was a LOT of wiggle room; he very reluctantly agreed to raise my T4 meds to 88mcg and again stressed how he doesn't want me to get those dangerous hyper symptoms... I've NEVER been hyper in my life. At this rate, 88mcg might get me below a 5.

I asked about my rheumatology referal he did for me in September (about my extreme symptoms) because I haven't heard from them yet and he said they had it and then he complained how they kept asking him for tests that they can get themselves and they are wasting his time... I'm guessing there is a chance they haven't called me yet (3 months later) because he won't give them my labs or refuses to run the tests they want.

At this point I was getting upset and starting to get flustered. I told him I wanted off Synthroid and wanted to try NDT. I explained that I wanted to try something completely different because I felt worse, and because my T3 and FT4 labs are still in the bottom half of the range... bottom 10% to 25% really. All I wanted was a trial...

He said no. Flat out no. He said his "scientific mind" could not in good conscience let me try that "inferior product", that Synthroid is identical to what is in my body. He said that I was welcome to shop around for some doctor who is "willing to give a patient whatever they ask for" and that there are naturopaths out there who will do that sort of thing... but "no hard feelings".

Grrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr! :aim33: 
At least I got him to change the meds from Synthroid to another brand, perhaps I'll at least stop swelling when I take my meds.:sad0049:

I have never had such a frustrating appointment with a doctor ...ever! I was frustrated into tears and almost speechless. I lost my ability to argue my points with him even though I had it written down. I was so flustered that I didn't even notice that my FT4 has gone down since the last appointment (which he had commented that he would have liked to see my previous FT4 higher... but this month's FT4 is apparently normal).

So... what would cause my FT4 to go down when my meds were increased? I went from a 15.3 to a 14.3 (ref 10.0-25.0). Is it because I seem to be reacting badly to synthroid? I don't get it. My total T3 didn't budge an inch... and he won't run a FT3 for some reason.

Any ideas on my labs? Why would FT4 go down? I'm still pretty new to this so advice would be welcome.

And yes, I'll be doctor shopping as soon as I can... The pompous jerk. :tongue0020:


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## Andros (Aug 26, 2009)

nvsmom said:


> I had one of _*those*_ appointments today where all I want to do now is find my doctor's car so I can egg it.  Grrr. I'll tell you about it in a moment.
> 
> Today's appointment was just a check on my labs. I'm posting all of my labs from this fall below because I've only been recognized and treated as hypo since the late summer. I had my TSH checked when I found out I was a celiac because I knew the two diseases are often linked. I'm hoping you all can offer me advice or see any trends I'm missing.
> 
> ...


Wow! If you are in Canada, try Erfa Pharmaceuticals Thyroid®.

Talk about living in a box; this doc takes the cake!


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## Lovlkn (Dec 20, 2009)

Take some antihistamine to deal with the allergic reaction while you find another doctor. What concerns me is your lips swelling and the possibility of your throat becoming involved.

I have a friend who is allergic (tested by an allergist) to Armour and takes Claritin daily to deal with it.

You are still hypo - FT-4 and FT-3 are what you need to be dosing off not TSH.


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## alliebeth88 (Oct 25, 2012)

I understand your frustration and definitely think you should search for a new doctor. You aren't asking for anything outlandish to try Armour. On the other hand, the doctor is responsible for what he prescribes, so if he doesn't feel comfortable prescribing Armour, that's his choice. It just means he is not the doctor for you!


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## nvsmom (Sep 30, 2012)

Andros said:


> Wow! If you are in Canada, try Erfa Pharmaceuticals Thyroid®.
> 
> Talk about living in a box; this doc takes the cake!


Thanks Andros. I'll make a note of it. 



Lovlkn said:


> Take some antihistamine to deal with the allergic reaction while you find another doctor. What concerns me is your lips swelling and the possibility of your throat becoming involved.
> 
> I have a friend who is allergic (tested by an allergist) to Armour and takes Claritin daily to deal with it.
> 
> You are still hypo - FT-4 and FT-3 are what you need to be dosing off not TSH.


I am hoping to avoid taking something that causes a reaction in the long term but I may add antihistamines.... I don't know why I didn't think of that! LOL I'm not getting stuffed up by it, so I wonder if it will help.... I don't have many allergies so I don't deal with this often.

I agree with you about dosing off the TSH. If our reference range was narrower, this wouldn't be an issue yet since he would still be upping my T4 dosage without the pushing from me.

Thanks for the response Lovlkn. 



alliebeth88 said:


> I understand your frustration and definitely think you should search for a new doctor. You aren't asking for anything outlandish to try Armour. On the other hand, the doctor is responsible for what he prescribes, so if he doesn't feel comfortable prescribing Armour, that's his choice. It just means he is not the doctor for you!


Yep, he's not the doctor for me.  LOL

Thanks Alliebeth88


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## nvsmom (Sep 30, 2012)

short update...

I haven't been to a new doctor yet. It's been a busy season with the holidays, company, and three of my family's birthday parties in the last month. I'm working on it though.

Dr. R prescribed me 88mcg of another T4 brand which does not make the meds in 88mcg sizes so my pharmacy couldn't fill it. Sigh.  I am still annoyed enough with him that I never bothered calling his office, I just had the pharmacy give me the rest of my 75mcg Synthroid tablets and have been living with the puffy mouth.

On the bright side, and I know some of you won't agree with this, but I decided to up my dosage to 100mcg rather than the measely 88mcg that I had to fight with him to give me. I now take 1 and 1/3 of 75mcg synthroid tablets per day, and have since early December. I wasn't worried about going hyper because my last dosage increase of 25mcg from 50 to 75mcg just decreased my TSH from 7 something to just below 6, and somehow decreased my FT4 while not touching my TT3.

Anyway...I have actually felt some glimmers of normality over the holidays!!! I've had a few days, just over a week in fact, where I didn't feel slow or dull, and when I wasn't sighing or yawning all the time. Plus my hair loss is not excessive anymore and I'm actually getting some new growth. I also haven't had any new small joint pain. I've now lost that energy with onset of pms, but still... it was there! For example, I went sledding with the kids a couple times and it wasn't just a chore! Yeah!

I think my dose is getting closer to where it should be and I'm getting excited! This is the first time, since July, that I haven't felt WORSE on thyroid hormone therapy... I was honestly starting to worry that it would never end!

My plan is to keep taking my 100mcg dose with my 75mcg tablets. When that runs out, I'll get my 50mcg tablets that I still have at the pharmacy and take a couple of those. I'm looking forward to the 50mcg tablets as they didn't puff up my mouth (as far as I ever noticed anyways). Hopefully, I'll get another doctor within the next month and get him to run my next 7-8 week labs for me. If not I'll go back to Dr. R., try to get him to actually listen to me and my symptoms, and get him to prescribe me at least 100mcg in 50 mcg tablets until I find someone better.

I want to get my TSH under 2, a 1 would be better. I want my FT4 at about 70% of the reference range, and I want my FT3 near there too. If my frees don't go up as my TSH approaches 1, I want T3 hormones prescribed... Hopefully I'll have a new doctor by then.

I'm considering adding FT3 onto my lab requisition since he doesn't.  Bad I know, but I'm fed up. I know it's not totally honest but he's not giving me adequate care. If he doesn't treat me properly, I'll lie and get it done somehow ...until I find a good doctor that is.


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## proud-armywife (Jul 29, 2011)

It makes me sad that we feel like we need to figure things out on our own and doctors don't seem to get it. I definetly have felt the effect of doctors not listening- it leaves you feeling hopeless and I feel trapped with no way to make anything better. I joke with my husband and mom have you ever seen that commercial where they ask the car guy (Honda commercial) He goes eeeeeeeh before every sentence? That is my doc- I go I'm not feeling well- can we check my panels? She goes eeeeeeh I don't think I'm going to do that. Well, maybe its mono can we check that? eeeeeeeeh I don't think so it isn't mono...... LOL So its a joke in the house now- we always answer with the eeeeeeeh..... when I talk about going to doc.....don't know if you understand but it does make me laugh I hope you get to the bottom of this- any type of swelling should be of concern and I cannot believe that he pushed it aside. I hope you find a great doc soon!


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