# Synthrid to Armour Conversion



## artms (Jul 23, 2011)

I'm happy to say that I had a great appt with my doc today. I will be seeing an Endo but it won't be until Dec. In the meantime I'll be taking Armour for the T3. I'm not sure how to convert. I think I would feel good on between 88 and 100 mcg or around 94mcg of Synthroid ,how much Armour would be equivalent? I have 60's and 15's to play with. I don't want too much but I don't want too little.


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## lainey (Aug 26, 2010)

No offense, but what ever doctor prescribed the Armour should have given you a starting dose, and lab orders for about 6 weeks later. This needs to be titrated like every other thyroid medication.

You shouldn't be dosing yourself, and you still need the follow up blood work LONG before December.


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## Andros (Aug 26, 2009)

artms said:


> I'm happy to say that I had a great appt with my doc today. I will be seeing an Endo but it won't be until Dec. In the meantime I'll be taking Armour for the T3. I'm not sure how to convert. I think I would feel good on between 88 and 100 mcg or around 94mcg of Synthroid ,how much Armour would be equivalent? I have 60's and 15's to play with. I don't want too much but I don't want too little.


I agree with Lainey. Normally, the patient is started on 30 mg.(1/2) grain of Armour; then lab every 8 weeks and Armour titrated upward as needed by 1/4 to 1/2 grain.

I don't get the conversion thing at all Synthroid, Levoxyl and others do not contain T3; therefore, how can you convert it? Just one humble person's perspective.

If not for Armour, I would not be at all functional so suffice it to say I am a fan. But I am not in favor of inappropriate Rx and use of this very valuable and life-saving pharmaceutical for those who need it to survive.

Many many have been over-dosed on Armour in the initial stages only to find that they never again can tolerate any kind of T3. That is sad and I don't want that to happen to you!

We are here for you at all times but maybe you should re-discuss this with your doctor as to how to go about this.

http://www.frx.com/pi/armourthyroid_pi.pdf


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## Enigma (Jun 13, 2011)

My doctor started me at 60mg and then 90mg (60mg in AM 30 in PM)... should I be worried about this? I was on 75mcg Levoxyl and it was NOT working- I felt horrendous even though my numbers were headed in the right direction (see my signature for numbers). She was pretty confident that I would need to be on 90mg. I had no problems on 60mg, and felt GREAT!! Started the second 30mg yesterday and woke up today, for the first time in years, with NO ACHES AND PAINS!!! A tiny bit stiff, but not incapacitated as other mornings.

I go back for blood work the week of Sept 10th. Should I be more worried that the dose is too high before then? Or just go with it unless something crops up?


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## Andros (Aug 26, 2009)

Enigma said:


> My doctor started me at 60mg and then 90mg (60mg in AM 30 in PM)... should I be worried about this? I was on 75mcg Levoxyl and it was NOT working- I felt horrendous even though my numbers were headed in the right direction (see my signature for numbers). She was pretty confident that I would need to be on 90mg. I had no problems on 60mg, and felt GREAT!! Started the second 30mg yesterday and woke up today, for the first time in years, with NO ACHES AND PAINS!!! A tiny bit stiff, but not incapacitated as other mornings.
> 
> I go back for blood work the week of Sept 10th. Should I be more worried that the dose is too high before then? Or just go with it unless something crops up?


I really don't know how to answer that. You know of course that I wish the best for you and want you to feel better.

However, that is a high dose in a few short weeks. You will just have to see, I guess.

I don't like to be a doomsayer but do prefer to err on the side of caution.

Just pay attention to how you feel. And we are here for you!


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## artms (Jul 23, 2011)

Andros,can you explain this a little?
"Many many have been over-dosed on Armour in the initial stages only to find that they never again can tolerate any kind of T3. That is sad and I don't want that to happen to you!"
I was very hypo on 88 mcg Synthroid. The conversion chart for that dose was 60 on Armour. So she's staring me on 60 mg. Since I needed to be in between I have 15's in order to take if I think I need it. We will retest. I don't want to take too much and definitely don't want too little. I think 30mg would have been too low based on my last labs. Of course it would have been good to see an Endo sooner but this woman is really good so I'll have to wait. Kudos to my Doc for recognizing that I have to go by how I feel knowing I won't go overboard. It's clear I'm not converting and we discussed adding Cytomel but Armour seemed to be a better choice and I'm looking forward to waking up.


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## Andros (Aug 26, 2009)

artms said:


> Andros,can you explain this a little?
> "Many many have been over-dosed on Armour in the initial stages only to find that they never again can tolerate any kind of T3. That is sad and I don't want that to happen to you!"
> I was very hypo on 88 mcg Synthroid. The conversion chart for that dose was 60 on Armour. So she's staring me on 60 mg. Since I needed to be in between I have 15's in order to take if I think I need it. We will retest. I don't want to take too much and definitely don't want too little. I think 30mg would have been too low based on my last labs. Of course it would have been good to see an Endo sooner but this woman is really good so I'll have to wait. Kudos to my Doc for recognizing that I have to go by how I feel knowing I won't go overboard. It's clear I'm not converting and we discussed adding Cytomel but Armour seemed to be a better choice and I'm looking forward to waking up.


I could not agree more; Armour is a better choice than adding Cytomel.

And no way would I usurp what your doctor has instructed. I consider all posts to be for discussion purposes only and I most certainly am not a doctor.

Follow your doctor's instructions. No two persons have the same needs nor do they have the same exact symptoms or systems.


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## artms (Jul 23, 2011)

What was that about T3 and Armour overdose?


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## Andros (Aug 26, 2009)

artms said:


> What was that about T3 and Armour overdose?


Did you check out the link I provided for Armour Prescribing information?

Each grain has 9 mcg. of T3. That is a lot. Most folks who start on Cytomel only start on 5 mcg. and sometimes that is too much and they have to cut the pill in half and back down to 2.5 mcg. for 8 weeks.


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## artms (Jul 23, 2011)

I scanned the link.....I am just checking in before head out. I understand the part about strength of T3 but I didn't understand the part about taking too much and not tolerating it after that. When I get back home I'll look at the link in depth...and BTW thanks so much for your input. It's invaluable.


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## Andros (Aug 26, 2009)

artms said:


> I scanned the link.....I am just checking in before head out. I understand the part about strength of T3 but I didn't understand the part about taking too much and not tolerating it after that. When I get back home I'll look at the link in depth...and BTW thanks so much for your input. It's invaluable.


I don't understand it either but it happens; that much I know for a fact. It would seem the system will no longer tolerate it for whatever reason. I have read it time and again on many forums over the years.


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## Enigma (Jun 13, 2011)

Andros said:


> I really don't know how to answer that. You know of course that I wish the best for you and want you to feel better.
> 
> However, that is a high dose in a few short weeks. You will just have to see, I guess.
> 
> ...


I am so confused now  In an earlier thread I started (http://www.thyroidboards.com/showthread.php?t=3708) you said you thought 90mg was a good dose. But here you said it may not be? And I had no idea about the T3 OD/tolerance- could that be a problem? I am very worried now about taking the full 90mg and that it could make things worse in the long run? How will I know if that is not what I need? I took just 60mg for the first 5 days and had all my hypo symptoms come back full force in that short time (horrible aches, severe hair loss, extreme dry mouth, incapacitating brain fog) but today I finally woke up pain-free and am able to get tons of stuff done, and I took the 90mg for the first time yesterday. Should I call my doc though??? Should i stay on the 60mg longer?? Or cut the 30mg in half and take that for a while then the whole pill??

I am so confused and worried now


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## artms (Jul 23, 2011)

Well you should be happy you woke up and enjoy your day. I read the too much can cause thyroid storm. I also was interested in T3 Thyronine Syndrome. 
I found this link for T3 Syndrome...don't know if it's the same but it was kinda funny. http://frozensouth.com/2008/10/13/t3-syndrome.aspx..I thought it was having a 'senior moment' LOL
I'm finding this all to be complicated and fascinating. The body is amazing.


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## Andros (Aug 26, 2009)

Enigma said:


> I am so confused now  In an earlier thread I started (http://www.thyroidboards.com/showthread.php?t=3708) you said you thought 90mg was a good dose. But here you said it may not be? And I had no idea about the T3 OD/tolerance- could that be a problem? I am very worried now about taking the full 90mg and that it could make things worse in the long run? How will I know if that is not what I need? I took just 60mg for the first 5 days and had all my hypo symptoms come back full force in that short time (horrible aches, severe hair loss, extreme dry mouth, incapacitating brain fog) but today I finally woke up pain-free and am able to get tons of stuff done, and I took the 90mg for the first time yesterday. Should I call my doc though??? Should i stay on the 60mg longer?? Or cut the 30mg in half and take that for a while then the whole pill??
> 
> I am so confused and worried now


Sorry for the confusion. I hesitate to usurp the doctor's instructions and I try find a "back door" method of getting info across.

I did say that it will pack a punch. LOL! Also, your circumstances are not the same as the other poster. I believe her doctor has left it up to her as to what dose she might take? If memory serves?

And again; these are only discussions. Tossing the ball around as they say. I am not a doctor; no way! Do what your doctor tells you to do if you think that is the right thing to do. That is the best way to approach these things.

If there is an area of confusion, you should always confer with your doctor!


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## artms (Jul 23, 2011)

This is all rather interesting. Everyone is different that's true. I personally seem not to be converting T4 so I am looking forward to the Armour....though as yet I feel only slightly better. From what I've read it's all a rollercoaster with Hashi's. It seems ,at least in my situation, I may get in the ballpark but I may never have a consistent level of comfort depending on what my antibodies are doing on a day to day basis. I am at least more informed about my condition. I probably got this with my first child and went 25 years undiagnosed. When I finally got meds I WOKE UP...wow. That's why i said to the other poster...enjoy your day. It's such a difference that I had no idea I was missing out on all those years and aren't we lucky that we can take something that will change our lives that much! 
When I was diagnosed I thought ok Hashimoto's gave me hypothyroid..that's all. Well unbelievably it wasn't until a few weeks ago I began to understand it and really connect the dots, what an eye opener! If the thyroid burns itself out does that solve the problem of swings in levels? 
BTW I don't want to give the impression that there was any irresponsibility with my med dosage. My individual needs seem to fall in a gray area and my Dr and I are in communication so hopefully it will all work out. It could be,as Andros said , there is only ballpark at best converting Synthroid dosage to Armour since it is only T4. In my case, a straight conversion for 88mcg Synthroid to 60 mg Armour may be ok since it has T3 and that is what I actually need. 
As an aside,something that really bugged me was that I had huge amounts of hair loss so maybe getting off Synthroid will help that too.I have to say that because of this board and the internet in general I was able to discuss the ferritan relationship to hair loss with my Dr so she added that to my labs. 
It can be confusing at times with discussions and that is to be considered in the exchanges but overall thank god for the internet and availability of information and community.


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