# Please help with these lab results



## Marathon Man (Aug 31, 2011)

Please help me with these lab results. I am a 40 year old 6' 180# male with hashimoto's disease. I am very active. I run 20-30 miles per week. I currently take 200 mcg synthroid daily. I also take a 300 mg testosterone shot monthly. My testosterone level seems very low. My wife gave birth to our son 10 months ago and my libido is strong but I am concerned that the testosterone is "off the chart". My endocrineologist upped me to 300 mcg synthroid/day and I had to dial it down because it felt like too much. Can anyone make heads or tails of this? The only symptom I complain about is late day brain fog and fatigue. I am also totally wiped out after a hard racing effort. I supplement with Selenium, Zinc, Fish oil, B-12 and Magnesium. I am eager to hear any ideas or suggestions.

Date	TSH	T4	T3	Testosterone
1/31/11	0.059	10.9	102	98
3/3/11 240
3/31/11	0.022	10.8	121	250
5/31/11 181
8/30/11	0.045	10.8	103	145
9/19/11	0.113	10.4	95	247

TSH LIMIT: 0.45 -4.5 
T4 LIMIT: 4.5 - 12 
T3 LIMIT: 71 - 180 
TESTOSERONE RANGE: 350-1030


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## lainey (Aug 26, 2010)

I answered this in the "lab results folder"......cross posting the same question in different folders makes it difficult to keep track of them.


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## Andros (Aug 26, 2009)

Marathon Man said:


> Please help me with these lab results. I am a 40 year old 6' 180# male with hashimoto's disease. I am very active. I run 20-30 miles per week. I currently take 200 mcg synthroid daily. I also take a 300 mg testosterone shot monthly. My testosterone level seems very low. My wife gave birth to our son 10 months ago and my libido is strong but I am concerned that the testosterone is "off the chart". My endocrineologist upped me to 300 mcg synthroid/day and I had to dial it down because it felt like too much. Can anyone make heads or tails of this? The only symptom I complain about is late day brain fog and fatigue. I am also totally wiped out after a hard racing effort. I supplement with Selenium, Zinc, Fish oil, B-12 and Magnesium. I am eager to hear any ideas or suggestions.
> 
> Date	TSH	T4	T3	Testosterone
> 1/31/11	0.059	10.9	102	98
> ...


Your Total T3 is in the basement. This is unfortunate because the Total 3 test consists of bound, unbound and rT3 (reverse) hormone.

Your FREE T3 is your active hormone. I suggest you get FREE T3 test. It no doubt will be low because the Total is low. You may be a candidate for T3 supplementation via changing to Armour or adding Cytomel to a lower dose of thyroxine.

Free T3 and Free T4 are the only accurate measurement of the actual active thyroid hormone levels in the body. This is the hormone that is actually free and exerting effect on the cells. These are the thyroid hormones that count.
http://www.drlam.com/articles/hypothyroidism.asp?page=3

I don't know what your doc is thinking by raising your Synthroid w/o the FREE T3 and FREE T4 tests.


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## bigfoot (May 13, 2011)

There is definitely an interaction between thyroid problems and testosterone. In fact, I had no idea about this until I joined this forum, and that was after being on both thyroid meds and testosterone gel for over a years' time.

It is definitely something to keep an eye on and make sure your doctor or endo stays on top of it. You need both a good thyroid level and testosterone level for your body to properly function. It's hard to point to either one as the sole source of your fatigue and brain fog, as it probably has something to do with both.

One thing to make sure of -- if your doc wants you to begin testosterone shots or gels, be sure to find out why your testosterone level is so low *first*. There aren't many docs out there that fully understand male hormone issues.

The shots require that you come in each week, whereas with the gel packets, pump, or patches (Androgel, Testim) you just rub onto upper arms and shoulders or stick on your abdomen at home. One downside of the gel is you need to be super-careful not to transfer any of it to your family members on accident. I have heard the shots peak at the beginning of the week and wind down over the course of the week leaving folks feeling tired; supposedly the gels are more consistent as you apply those daily at the same time. The ultimate would be the patches that provide a steady stream over 24 hours. Downside of the patches: they can leave your skin pretty irritated. I had to discontinue them and move to the gel packets (great for traveling, BTW).

hugs6


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## Brucergoldberg (May 23, 2011)

I read this with great interest. I wanted to tell you there is a new testosterone that you put under your arm like deodorant. I am on this. Is called axiron. If you ask your doctor for it, he can give a card good for a free month and then 20.00 a month for 12 mos. It's like androgel but very safe and you can still wear deodorant.


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## Marathon Man (Aug 31, 2011)

I have a very snuggly wife and an 11 month old son I am worried about getting this Axiron on. Do you think that's a problem?

What kinds of results have you had with your numbers? I feel like I have the energy of an 80 year old.


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## bigfoot (May 13, 2011)

I can relate -- my folks in their 60s *literally* have more energy than me. No joke. (Granted, I have other issues including thyroid problems.) My testosterone level was discovered as low last year in the low 200's. After a few months on 5gm Androgel packets it was raised up to the 400s. From there it climbed a bit into the 500s. Then, after about six months it started to tank again, dropping into the 400s.

The range for testosterone levels is different according to the lab used. Some show 300-800, others 300-1000, and still others about 300-1200. What the "ideal" level would be for each person is a mystery. I personally think that having something in the 600-700 range would be roughly in the middle and a good place to work towards. It also varies by doctor -- some are reluctant to want an increase, either through fear of steroid abuse or by feeling your level is "fine". At the moment my T level came back in the 700s recently. Another catch is that as you add more testosterone your body scales back its own production. So that 5gm that might work great now will require an increase in the future. It does take months to begin to really boost your overall numbers, but if you are truly low in testosterone, you will notice having added it within *days*. More energy, more libido, more pep, more stamina, etc.

Thanks for the info on Axiron! Definitely looks interesting. :anim_32:

I think as long as you are careful any of the solutions can work for you. With the gels they say to wear a t-shirt over the application site(s), or if you are going to be intimate to shower thoroughly, washing the site(s) with soap and water. The gel itself dries within a couple of minutes and is alcohol-based. Same goes for your hands -- wash them well with soap and water and the gel is gone. Ideally you apply the gel after you shower and dry off, that way it is immediately absorbed into your open pores.

The flip-side of all of this is estrogen. Increasing your testosterone can actually boost your estrogen levels, too. Only one doc I have seen even knew much about this. The rest have either said it didn't matter or weren't concerned. But a quick Google search on bodybuilding forums turns up information to the contrary. The increased estrogen can cause "aromatase" activity which is, I believe, when the excess estrogen shunts the testosterone you just applied away from the receptor sites. Not to mention the extra estrogen can cause body fat, fatigue, mood issues, etc. (Many of the same symptoms of low testosterone or thyroid problems.) If you can find a doctor who understands all of the angles you are light years ahead of most of us.

Supposedly one way to help naturally reduce the estrogen load is by eating fiber and getting enough exercise. Of course, eating too much fiber can reduce the effectiveness of thyroid med absorption, and exercising too heavily can cause a flare-up of stuff like Hashi's. It's a tough balancing act!


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## Marathon Man (Aug 31, 2011)

My lowest T test was 98 with a scale of normal being 249-836. The strange thing is that my libido is not down.

I am an avid runner and I have noticed that after a hard run effort I am just dead. I would hate to have to give up running.

I'm curious if the Axiron can raise my levels to normal. I'm shooting 300 ml of testosterone every three weeks. All I have to show for it is a bruised bum.


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## peacesells560 (Aug 9, 2011)

Did your Dr. run an Estrogen test as well? Sometimes testosterone gets converted to estrogen.


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## Marathon Man (Aug 31, 2011)

No estrogen test.


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