# Interpreting thyroid test results and hypo-experience



## areya2005 (Nov 28, 2011)

hey guys,

So I'll make this short and brief. I have always suspected some sort of hypo problem, but my TSH was always "normal," so I didn't get prescribed any medication. Doctors also dont take me seriously because I'm in good shape, but they don't understand that I have the best grasp on my diet as possible (I'm a natural bodybuilder), so I can manipulate calories as I need them.

Anywho, I finally found a doctor who took me seriously. Displaying ALL hypo symptoms, my tests came back with TSH-2.1, FT4-.97 (has been decreasing over time) and my FT3- 2.4. While "normal," TSH is higher than I'd like and the FT3 and FT4 are on the LOW side of normal, so my doc prescribed 25mcg of synthroid, hoping it would relieve some symptoms and raise my levels.

While on synthroid, despite starting a diet the week before, I even gained weight and felt worse than before. My doctor said I could stop taking it, so I did, and I feel better than while on it, but still not well.

Now I've read problems of people taking small doses of synthroid and it shutting down the rheostat in their hypothalmus. I think that may have been what happened to me. I would like to get on armour, but my doc thinks it's a bad idea.

I'm just looking for thoughts and opinions. Obviously, my symptoms are there. As much as I hate medication, if that's what would make me feel better, I'm more than willing to stick to it.


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## Travis (Nov 24, 2011)

Check out my post (a few down from yours).. Apparently, you can have T3 and T4 levels that show hypo, but, actually have hyper symptoms. There's more to it than just T3 and T4 levels. I'm still learning this stuff, too.. but, there's some good help/info on this site.

My doctor tried me on the same drug, and just 25mcg made me feel 10 times worse. It made me more anxious, nervous, etc..

Travis


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## Andros (Aug 26, 2009)

areya2005 said:


> hey guys,
> 
> So I'll make this short and brief. I have always suspected some sort of hypo problem, but my TSH was always "normal," so I didn't get prescribed any medication. Doctors also dont take me seriously because I'm in good shape, but they don't understand that I have the best grasp on my diet as possible (I'm a natural bodybuilder), so I can manipulate calories as I need them.
> 
> ...


Hi and welcome. Would you mind reposting your lab results with the ranges? Different labs use different ranges.

Most of us find we feel our best when TSH is @ 1.0 or less and the FREES above the mid-range of the ranges provided by your lab. Since you are a body builder, you know that FREE T3 is your active hormone and you cannot function w/o sufficient T3; body building or not.


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## areya2005 (Nov 28, 2011)

Absolutely. From as far as I can tell, conversion isn't so much the problem, but I have a feeling the presence of synthetic hormone, no matter how much the dose, lowered natural production, leaving me with lower hormone than before.

Lab results:

TSH: 2.1 Ref range: .3-3.0
FT4: .97 Ref Range: .85-1.7
FT3: 2.3 Ref Range: 2.2-4.5


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## Andros (Aug 26, 2009)

areya2005 said:


> Absolutely. From as far as I can tell, conversion isn't so much the problem, but I have a feeling the presence of synthetic hormone, no matter how much the dose, lowered natural production, leaving me with lower hormone than before.
> 
> Lab results:
> 
> ...


Thanks for the ranges; I appreciate you doing that.

Both your Frees are low. 1.2 is about mid-range for the FT4 and 3.3 is about mid-range for the FT3. You are in need of supplementation for sure. FT3 should ideally be at about 75% of the range given by your lab.

If the Synthroid made you feel worse and it surely could (how long did you take the 25 mcg.?) and if you think you would do better on Armour, try to find a doctor who agrees w/that.

In the meantime, you may wish to get some antibodies' tests and also an ultra-sound.

TSI (thyroid stimulating immunoglobulin)http://www.medicineonline.com/topics/t/2/Thyroid-Stimulating-Immunoglobulin/TSI.html,TPO (antimicrosomal antibodies) TBII (thyrotropin-binding inhibitory immunoglobulin), Thyroglobulin Ab, ANA (antinuclear antibodies), (thyroid hormone panel) TSH, Free T3, Free T4.

You can look this stuff up here and more.........
http://www.labtestsonline.org/

And...............as evidenced by the above labs, you already have lowered production so it would be hard to prove your theory out.

Also, are you taking any supplements that contain L-carnitine and/or soy or both?


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## areya2005 (Nov 28, 2011)

I was on 25mcg for only 2 weeks. While it wasn't long, me gaining weight while dieting was very clear indicator for me that something was wrong. Again, as ridiculous as it sounds, I'm a bodybuilder and KNOW how to diet and manipulate my weight in any direction.

I don't think I had an antibodies test done, but I did have an ultra sound and there was a tiny cyst. I was told it was nothing to worry about.

So what could I tell my doctor to prescribe me some armour? Again, I don't want to be on meds either, but if it will make me feel better, I'm all for it.


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## Andros (Aug 26, 2009)

areya2005 said:


> I was on 25mcg for only 2 weeks. While it wasn't long, me gaining weight while dieting was very clear indicator for me that something was wrong. Again, as ridiculous as it sounds, I'm a bodybuilder and KNOW how to diet and manipulate my weight in any direction.
> 
> I don't think I had an antibodies test done, but I did have an ultra sound and there was a tiny cyst. I was told it was nothing to worry about.
> 
> So what could I tell my doctor to prescribe me some armour? Again, I don't want to be on meds either, but if it will make me feel better, I'm all for it.


Nobody knows nutrition better than a body builder. So, are you taking L-carnitine or soy?

A lot of doctors are not open to Rx'ing Armour. You are going to have to inquire around. If not for Armour, I would be dead. That much I know.

So, I am on your side and I do believe you about your knowing nutrition. I would still be a gym rat if they did not close the gym in our area. I am from the old school; I love free weights. That is not to say that the modern equipment does not have it benefits but give me the stairmaster and free weights any day and I am a happy camper.


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## areya2005 (Nov 28, 2011)

I loved that post, Andros. Free weights, stairmaster and a steak!

Well I've taken L-Carnitine, but not regularly, and I haven't stayed away from soy, but I don't necessarily ask for it either.

What were your experiences where you say Armour was your best bet. I'm going to go over everything with the doc and ask her just to try it out, maybe 1/2 grain for a month to see what the results are like. I can always stop, right?


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## Andros (Aug 26, 2009)

areya2005 said:


> I loved that post, Andros. Free weights, stairmaster and a steak!
> 
> Well I've taken L-Carnitine, but not regularly, and I haven't stayed away from soy, but I don't necessarily ask for it either.
> 
> What were your experiences where you say Armour was your best bet. I'm going to go over everything with the doc and ask her just to try it out, maybe 1/2 grain for a month to see what the results are like. I can always stop, right?


If you have a thyroid problem, you will be on replacement for life. There is no on again, off again w/this stuff.

Okay, soy and L-carnitine "are" goitrogens. Actually, L-carnitine is used to treat hyperthyroid!

So, start reading labels religiously. Soy is also estrogenic and this in fact is what causes the hypo.

In my case, I was not converting T4 to T3. I could not even walk around the block. I had a lot of trouble finding a doctor to Rx Armour for me but thank God I did. I have thrived ever since. It's been a good 18 years or more on the Armour.

Not everybody needs Armour but for those that do, it's a God send!

1/2 grain is the appropriate place to start. Then you get labs every 8 weeks and get it titrated upward as needed until you plateau (euthyroid) and feel great.


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## areya2005 (Nov 28, 2011)

But like, if it's not working, I could come off, right?

My question is if I start, would I end of worse than I am "normally"?

And why are doctors so against armour?


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## Andros (Aug 26, 2009)

areya2005 said:


> But like, if it's not working, I could come off, right?
> 
> My question is if I start, would I end of worse than I am "normally"?
> 
> And why are doctors so against armour?


This question leads me to ask, what do you want thyroxine replacement to do for you? I am not totally clear on your issue at this point.

Some docs are regimented in their thinking and they were taught Synthroid, Synthroid. Not willing to think outside the box.

It would be very interesting to do a poll of these doctors to find out "really" why they are opposed to Armour. LOL!!


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## areya2005 (Nov 28, 2011)

Andros,

I want a few things from hormonal replacement.

1. For all the symptoms to go away.
2. With all the efforts I put towards working out and keeping a proper diet, I would be a lot more successful in bodybuilding.

I'm not looking for a magic pill. I'm just looking for normalcy.


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## Bklyn11214 (Aug 5, 2011)

Can anyone tell me the difference between Levothyroxine and Armour. I had a partial thyroidectomy in August. I had a blood work up done in October and my T3 and T4 levels were normal but my TSH was 5.1. Also my cholesterol, though always high through inheritance, shot up from pre-surgery 218 to post surgery 283. My doctor put me on 25 mcg of Levothroxine but after my first month on it and no change in my TSH level, he just upped me to 50 mcg. I have to say that I am always dragging. When I go to the gym and do leg machines, the back of my legs above the knees feel as though I have run a 10k race. Muscles ache. I have put on at least 5 pounds since the surgery and that makes me feel horrible. Is the weight gain from the removal of half my thyroid, or is it menopause? Is Armour better? Any advice would be greatly appreciated.


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## areya2005 (Nov 28, 2011)

I'm not the expert at interpreting test results. Make a post and get some other people to chime in.

As far as the difference between Levothyroxine and Armour, Levothyroxine is solely T4. If you're not having a problem with T4->T3 conversion, it should be fine. Armour is a T4/T3 mix with a ratio of 4.22:1, which would be better if you're not properly converting the hormones.

The problem with Armour that I've read is that if people need a lot of T4, taking the right dose of Armour to supply enough T4 gives WAY too much T3. For some, a mix of Levothyroxine and Cytomel (T3) in proper dosages may be the right way to go.

BTW, take what I say with a grain of salt. I'm just starting to get educated on this stuff!


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## areya2005 (Nov 28, 2011)

So here's an updates:

I went to my endo today to update her with what was wrong with the medicine, etc., and she referred me to another specialist. She said she didn't feel comfortable prescribing anything else and I needed to go see someone who does more research and has more experience. With that said, I have an appointment at the end of next month.

BUT, I'm tired of all this bullshit and am going to take things into my own hands. I know the same old thing is going to happen with this other doctor, so I purchased some nature-throid and am going to self medicate, starting with 1/2 grain. I'll be as responsible as possible, take blood tests every 6-8 weeks and adjust if I need to. Additionally, I will be listening VERY closely to my body and will make decisions based on how I feel as well. I feel like I have no other options.

I'm also going to be completely honest with the new endo next month and tell her what I've been doing. More than likely, she'll ask me to take a blood test, and we'll take it from there.

I refuse to be shut down from "the system" and I will get better.


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## Andros (Aug 26, 2009)

areya2005 said:


> Andros,
> 
> I want a few things from hormonal replacement.
> 
> ...


Properly prescribed and monitored, I see no reason why Armour should not fill that bill.

Those are most reasonable expections. I share them w/you. Go for the "GOLD!"


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## areya2005 (Nov 28, 2011)

And how do you feel about my idea to self-medicate?


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## jepow3 (Sep 25, 2011)

Hi Areya I would never recommend self medicating for two reasons, even if doctors can be rubbish diagnosing and treating thyroid conditions they still have a whole host of complementary knowledge when it comes to supplementing hormones, the unfortunate thing is that messing with one hormone with affect others, and you need someone to monitor your progress on the medication closely. The second is down here in Oz if you self medicate and end up in the ER because of a complication to the medication your insurance won't cover the costs since you weren't acting under a doctors prescription!

I understand how frustrating it can be, I'm an amateur bodybuilder and my thyroid condition destroyed my gym routine and diet, I'm so soft right now and there is just nothing I can do about it for the moment.

Your t3 and t4 numbers were extremely low normal, and I think since your a bodybuilder it would be worth getting a reverse t3 test done to see if your converting correctly. A high revers t3 could also explain why supplementing t4 made you worse, since you would have converted the t4 strait to reverse t3. Bodybuilding puts an enormous strain on the body which can cause conversion issues. I would also recommend stopping all bodybuilding supplements.

What are your main symptoms? Muscle fatigue, joint pain ect? One of the first things I noticed was I no longer felt good after a workout at the gym until eventually going to the gym became just impossible.

The best advice I can give you is to be patient and find a doctor who will help you out, I can almost guarantee that 4 or 5 months of searching for the right doctor will get you back to gym quicker then self medicating and making a mistake.


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## HeidiBR (Apr 4, 2010)

I think you need to find someone who will work with you and the Armour and not just self-medicate. Ask at a pharmacy who prescribes it (it might be a GP and not an endo), make an appointment, and ask for a trial.

Bodybuilders have low body fat. Dieting in the form of reducing intake and reduced body fat can actually wreck havoc with the thyroid. Your calorie manipulation may be a factor in all this - actually, I would bet on it versus a systemic thyroid issue.

Also, being on .25 for 2 weeks is probably too little med, and not enough time to let it take effect. It can take over a year to level out on meds. If you take a small dose, sometimes the thyroid gets lazy and stops producing.

I don't know if you are a male or female but you probably should have a full hormone work up. Just to see if anything is out of whack.


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## Andros (Aug 26, 2009)

Bklyn11214 said:


> Can anyone tell me the difference between Levothyroxine and Armour. I had a partial thyroidectomy in August. I had a blood work up done in October and my T3 and T4 levels were normal but my TSH was 5.1. Also my cholesterol, though always high through inheritance, shot up from pre-surgery 218 to post surgery 283. My doctor put me on 25 mcg of Levothroxine but after my first month on it and no change in my TSH level, he just upped me to 50 mcg. I have to say that I am always dragging. When I go to the gym and do leg machines, the back of my legs above the knees feel as though I have run a 10k race. Muscles ache. I have put on at least 5 pounds since the surgery and that makes me feel horrible. Is the weight gain from the removal of half my thyroid, or is it menopause? Is Armour better? Any advice would be greatly appreciated.


Welcome to the board! We need to see your most recent thyroid lab tests with the ranges provided by your lab before we can really comment.

Make sure you get the FREES. This is the only way you will know if you are a candidate for the addition of T3.

Free T3 and Free T4 are the only accurate measurement of the actual active thyroid hormone levels in the body. This is the hormone that is actually free and exerting effect on the cells. These are the thyroid hormones that count.

http://www.drlam.com/articles/hypothyroidism.asp?page=3


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