# what is happening - too much?



## seabreeze (Jan 1, 2013)

I haven't felt well for the past couple days. Dizzy, a bit jittery, anxiety up and heart palps. Today is day 17 on 25 mcg levo. I'm going to try every other day now. I think my body is getting too much OR could I be on the wrong medication for me? Is this an indication of needing T3 also or no? I will call Dr. tomorrow and see what she says also but I'd sure like to know now what could be going on with my body. I feel worse now than before I went on this stuff.


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## joplin1975 (Jul 21, 2011)

Call your doctor.

But, it sure sounds like its too much. It's hard to say without labs...I'm guessing based on your symptoms. Have you had your TSI tested?


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## seabreeze (Jan 1, 2013)

I'll be calling tomorrow for sure. What is TSI? How long will these symptoms last if I don't take the medication? I have always been super sensitive to meds. They all seem to build up in my system! Except for my bio identical hormone creams - I've been good with them for many years.


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## mouthy83 (Jul 18, 2012)

I had the same when i was on too much levo... I was on 150mcg for a while then my thyroid kicked in and i was way over. Once my meds were reduced within a week my jittering calmed down. I had become so jittery i was actually twitching and jerking!

Let me know the outcome


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## surge (Aug 15, 2012)

I bet your doc says to ride it out. You're on a low dose. And the heart palps can be a symptom of either hypo or hyper, so it could be part of your body adjusting or could be overmedication or could be undermedication (great, right?). When you go back in for a blood draw for levels, you should definitely add the antibody check (TPO and TSI). I had high antibodies and they made me miserable on even 25mcg of levoxyl.


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## joplin1975 (Jul 21, 2011)

seabreeze said:


> I'll be calling tomorrow for sure. What is TSI? How long will these symptoms last if I don't take the medication? I have always been super sensitive to meds. They all seem to build up in my system! Except for my bio identical hormone creams - I've been good with them for many years.


TSI is thyroid stimulating immunoglobulin. I had high levels of TSI and was unable to tolerate even very low doses of synthroid before my thyroid was removed. http://www.medterms.com/script/main/art.asp?articlekey=5782


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## Jezahb (May 17, 2012)

I had those symptoms when I first started on Synthroid, and they sucked. However in a few weeks they settled down, for me I think it was just my body adjusting to the addition of synthetic thyroid hormones because I was definitely not hyper. Then again Synthroid never felt good with me, it always made me feel icky so I switched to Armour, and will never go back


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## sjmjuly (Mar 23, 2012)

Jezahb said:


> I had those symptoms when I first started on Synthroid, and they sucked. However in a few weeks they settled down, for me I think it was just my body adjusting to the addition of synthetic thyroid hormones because I was definitely not hyper. Then again Synthroid never felt good with me, it always made me feel icky so I switched to Armour, and will never go back


Ditto. Only I was on Levothroid and ended up in the ER. I take Naturethroid now and tolerate it much better. I was also dealing with a bout of hashitoxicosis which sucks to the max.


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## seabreeze (Jan 1, 2013)

WEll, I didn't take anything yesterday and started to feel better by mid afternoon. Dr. wanted me to go in today and get blood work taken so I did. Took 1/2 a pill first thing this AM and felt ok - did have one dizzy spell late AM and been feeling drained today. Is that a symptom of the levo., feeling drained and tired?


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## Jezahb (May 17, 2012)

Feeling drained and tired is more the symptoms of the underlying disease than the medication. I could be wrong however as I have never been on Levo.

Have you had your iron levels checked? Iron deficiency can go hand and hand with Hashi's and I know for me at least, my main symptoms of my pretty severe anemia were as you described. Doing simple things made my heart pound like I had run a marathon, I was dizzy if I moved my head too quickly (or sometimes at all). I never felt jittery, but honestly I think I was just too damn tired to exert the energy into being anxious!


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## seabreeze (Jan 1, 2013)

Iron is fine. I'm stopping the levo. medication! This is making me feel the worse I have ever felt in my life!!! The one day I did not take it, I felt a bit better, the next day, even better. Dr. told me to take a 1/2 pill yesterday and go get blood taken. I did. About 2 hours after taking just a 1/2, I felt dizzy and out of it. This am I took a 1/2 pill and now I feel AWFUL!!!! Feels like I go hypo and hyper within an hour. I"m SO TIRED I can't stay awake or function. I'm done with this stuff.


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## Octavia (Aug 1, 2011)

Did you get labwork done yesterday (or today)?


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## surge (Aug 15, 2012)

It really sounds like you're swinging b/c of the hashis. I know the misery of making yourself take T4 even when it feels like poison...when I felt this way, it actually had little to do with the low dose of meds and everything to do with the antibodies, so did you get your doc to add those to the blood draw? I'd be most curious about TSI. I had a 96 (over 100 is Graves range), but felt miserably jittery, muscles twitched, hair falling out like crazy, heart racing. My hormone function numbers (T3 and T4) were normal and my TSH was 5-6 (range 0-4), so while my numbers seemed like I needed T4, I felt miserably hyper sometimes, even on only 25mcg.

It might be worth trying the bio-identical, since a lot of people who don't do well on synthetic T4 seem to tolerate it better, but I also think you have some serious hashi swings going on and you probably need to be on some kind of medication to try and calm down the angry thyroid. grr.


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## seabreeze (Jan 1, 2013)

I got labs done on Monday. Will talk with Dr. on Friday. All I know is that taking T4 is not working for me with this medication anyway. I can't go back right now to test the TSI. They did not run it and the labs are too expensive. 
So are you taking the bio identicals then and do fine on them?? My regular Dr doesn't do those (that's the Dr. I'm seeing on Friday). But I have an appointment in Feb with my hormone Dr. and they do the bio identicals. I will then discuss that with him. I did ask the compounding pharmacist about the bio identicals but she really didn't explain what the difference was between the levo (synthetic) and the compounded ones. She just said they are ALL made by a man made molecule in the lab. NOTHING is "natural". I'm already taking bio identical hormone creams - estradiol, progesterone and testosterone and I was feeling great on those - got those all sorted out. Except for the low grade anxiety and that is when they found hashi's in my thyroid panel. So I thought - GREAT!! the missing puzzle piece. But I sure can't take this levo. T4!!

Did not take any this morning and still slight heart palps but, I feel more energetic. I'm NOT dragging tired. Head still a bit fuzzy but that will be gone by tomorrow.


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## seabreeze (Jan 1, 2013)

got new labs back. They ran a TSH RFX on abnormal to Free T4 which means they won't run a T4 unless TSH was abnormal - stupid!! But....
TSH was 2.08 range is -- 0.450-4.5
TPO was 532 high (last test it was greater than 1000)
T3 was 2.2 range is -- 2.0-4.4

So Dr. doesn't know what to do with me since I can't take levo. at the lowest dosage. I"m going to my hormone Dr. on Monday and see what he says. 
She says I'm "sub-clinical". Not showing severe signs of hypo or hyper but has antibodies. What to do????


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## surge (Aug 15, 2012)

Ugh. I know this sucks. I do think your thyroid is a piece of your health puzzle, it just doesn't look like it's going to be the easiest piece to figure out.

Have you read nasdaq phil's post on hashistoxicosis at the beginning of this forum? I wonder for you if this is what's going on. You have high TPO, so you probably do have other antibodies partying in there, as well (TSI IS an expensive test. It might be useful to know eventually, especially if you have a doctor who is sympathetic/receptive to treatment for you, but this doesn't sound like it's the case). I had the swings you describe and I really thought it was T4 related, but now that I've had my thyroid out and am doing much better on a much higher dose of T4, I think for me, it was antibody and nodule issues.

As you've read, some people do really well on the bio-identical hormone-- armour, unithroid, etc.-- and in particular, I notice a lot of hashis patients have decreased symptoms. I never tried this route because I was having heart and bp issues and it can exacerbate that.

Another approach (which you're not going to like) is slowly stepping up the dosage of the synthroid. My surgeon actually asked about this because she said she had seen it work for some hashis patients. From what I've read, it's about increasing slowly every 5-6 weeks by 12mcg. It can take 6months-years to get the exact right dose, but many of the worst symptoms fade in the first 6 months. I totally freaked out on even the 25mcg and really couldn't tolerate any more. Again, I think this is b/c of the antibodies. And then my bp just.kept.climbing so I opted to have the thyroid removed.

I'm with your doc in that I think you probably need some kind of treatment, t3/t4 combo or just t4, though since you are subclinical, if you wanted to try to go off the meds for a few weeks and see how you feel, it might help you mentally just to try and separate out what's med related. The danger is just that your T3 is really low and I think you'll end up feeling pretty bad at the end of 5-6weeks. But will it be worse than right now? eh, probably not.

Since your t3 is low, I guess if I were you'd, I'd try the armour, if your doc is willing to prescribe it.


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## seabreeze (Jan 1, 2013)

Went to see my hormone Dr. who is a very well known Dr. for thyroid too  Why I just didn't go to him for this in the first place...
Anyway, he looked at my labs and explained how it all works. Some I knew, some I didn't. He said my T4 is normal range but I'm low in T3. He said I didn't seem all that symptamatic with full blown Hashi's. He asked me all about how I feel and symptoms. He said just becasue one has antibodies, doesn't mean it's full blown. Just like all auto immune diseases. So.... he put me on a compound capsule of T3 only that is sustained release. So it didn't surprise him when my body went bezerk on T4.


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## surge (Aug 15, 2012)

Awesome. I'm glad you had some results for him to look at and it sounds like he's a good doc-- patient and thorough. Glad you're on a new plan and hope you feel better soon! Keep us updated!


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