# new Hashi's diag, labs normal



## prettynikki5 (Dec 9, 2009)

I was just officially diagnosed with Hashi's, I originally went to PCP with a long list of symptoms I've been having for around 6 mos. to a year, he ran lots of tests, which included an ANA screen which came back positive, referred me to a rhuematologist b/c some of my chief complaints were stiff muscles joints, one of my toes goes numb alot, carpal tunnel type pain etc...of course rhuemy runs every test possible, as my mother explained her other daughter (my younger sister) recently died from an autoimmune disease (kidneys) and she wants every possible test ran as we need to know what is wrong with me. He finds nothing, sends me to Endo. I already knew through many hours of googling and research online that I had an autoimmune Thyroid disease (go me!) so here I am at the Endo, sure nuff my thyroid is enlarged, 2 nodules, they just did a biopsy on one today, which sucked, and then he tells me that b/c my labs are all normal (TSH,T3T4) that I should not be having the symptoms I am having, b/c technically my thyroid is still working just fine according to my labs. But I have classic thyroid symptoms, actually I go back and forth between hyper and hypo (my own diag, as I practically need 2 set of clothes because my weight fluctuates 5-10 lbs) with the coordinating symptoms of each, yet my levels are all beautiful. He says he would possibly treat me with a very low dosage of some med to help me feel better. The newest symptom I have had for a week now is this dizzy/vertigo feeling, many many times a day. This feeling is so uncool to me, it feels horrible. So, anyway, I just want to feel better again, I have 5 kids to take care of. Does anybody else have symptoms but normal levels? Doc thinks I have another autoimmune disease possibly surfacing. I think it is just my thyroid. I am a bit scared to say the least. Anybody have the same issues before? Anyone have any input/info? I would be so grateful )


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## Andros (Aug 26, 2009)

prettynikki5 said:


> I was just officially diagnosed with Hashi's, I originally went to PCP with a long list of symptoms I've been having for around 6 mos. to a year, he ran lots of tests, which included an ANA screen which came back positive, referred me to a rhuematologist b/c some of my chief complaints were stiff muscles joints, one of my toes goes numb alot, carpal tunnel type pain etc...of course rhuemy runs every test possible, as my mother explained her other daughter (my younger sister) recently died from an autoimmune disease (kidneys) and she wants every possible test ran as we need to know what is wrong with me. He finds nothing, sends me to Endo. I already knew through many hours of googling and research online that I had an autoimmune Thyroid disease (go me!) so here I am at the Endo, sure nuff my thyroid is enlarged, 2 nodules, they just did a biopsy on one today, which sucked, and then he tells me that b/c my labs are all normal (TSH,T3T4) that I should not be having the symptoms I am having, b/c technically my thyroid is still working just fine according to my labs. But I have classic thyroid symptoms, actually I go back and forth between hyper and hypo (my own diag, as I practically need 2 set of clothes because my weight fluctuates 5-10 lbs) with the coordinating symptoms of each, yet my levels are all beautiful. He says he would possibly treat me with a very low dosage of some med to help me feel better. The newest symptom I have had for a week now is this dizzy/vertigo feeling, many many times a day. This feeling is so uncool to me, it feels horrible. So, anyway, I just want to feel better again, I have 5 kids to take care of. Does anybody else have symptoms but normal levels? Doc thinks I have another autoimmune disease possibly surfacing. I think it is just my thyroid. I am a bit scared to say the least. Anybody have the same issues before? Anyone have any input/info? I would be so grateful )


Hi and welcome Prettynikki5 Does not sound like your thyroid is working fine to me. When will you get the biopsy results? I am glad he at least did that. The very fact that you have nodules means something is afoot.

ANA (antinuclear antibodies) are not specific. They are "suggestive" of a myriad of autoimmune diseases which of course includes thyroid disease.

I agree w/you. I believe for now, it is just your thyroid and these pains are common. All of us will tell you so!:anim_63: However, that is not to say that something else is not going on or lying dormant. Many of us do in fact have more than one autoimmune disease but let's hope for now that is not the case w/ you.

These tests should have been run; if not, request them..............

The lab tests listed are helpful when it comes to sorting things out.

TSH, FREE T3, FREE T4, TPO (antimicrosomal antibodies), ANA (antinuclear antibodies), TSI (thyroid stimulating immunoglobulin) and Thyroglobulin Ab.

You can look all of the above up here so you know what they are for........
http://www.labtestsonline.org/

It's a good idea to start a folder and "always" get copies of your labs. When we look at results, we also need the ranges as different labs use different ranges.

Keep us posted. And yes, vertigo is on the list of symptoms for thyroid disease. It often affects the inner ear as the inflamation travels from the thyroid.


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## prettynikki5 (Dec 9, 2009)

Thank you so much for your input, it is all so overwhelming :confused0031: I want to be proactive and luckily I have access to E-Chart, where all of my labs, etc are viewable to me at any time, like seeing what the docs see in my files. This has been very helpful for me while I am going "stir crazy" trying to figure this whole thing out...It sucks when you have a problem that cannot be fixed, I am a problem solver, this is so complex :sad0049: I am glad that I found this forum. I will look up the other tests you listed, I am also going for a sleep study tomorrow night because it seems I have also developed sleep apnea in the past few months, I never get restful sleep anymore. Is this Hashi's too? I have never had medical issues my whole life, 5 normal, problem-free pregnancies, no meds, now a page and half long of symptoms started this year. I am abit freaked. I guess I just want to know all the answers and feel better. Seems to me like I also get "flare-ups" when I have hands,feets swelling, muscle tightness and pain, and then other times it's not so bad. My tailbone has been sore for 6 months too, I have a special pillow that I use at work that is awesome... I am only 30, this all just seems so crazy to me


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## prettynikki5 (Dec 9, 2009)

Oh, also, why do you say that about the nodules? Why are they there? Doesn't everyone with nodules get a biopsy done?


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## Andros (Aug 26, 2009)

prettynikki5 said:


> Oh, also, why do you say that about the nodules? Why are they there? Doesn't everyone with nodules get a biopsy done?


All your symptoms listed including the sleep apnea could very well be attributable to thyroid disorder.

To my knowledge, the healthy thyroid gland should not have nodules.

Why do you think your tail bone hurts? Do you have a pilondial cyst do you think?

http://www.webmd.com/skin-problems-and-treatments/pilondial-cyst


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## prettynikki5 (Dec 9, 2009)

no cycst, tailbone has just felt "bruised" when i use the tailbone pillow, it doesn't hurt. i really feel frail in general,like an old lady. My endo called me today (2days after biopsy) to tell me that he wasn't able to get enough material to get a good result. So he says he will monitor my nodules for growth by doing another ultrasound in 4 months. He has offered low dosage of Synthroid. I am put off by the fact that he tells me that my thyroid is enlarged and has the characteristics of hashimoto's but has yet to educate me on just what this disease is about, what to expect, what I need to do...isn't this important? When you go to the doctor and you have an illness, isn't he supposed to tell you how to treat, fix it? I feel so at a loss her because I did my part, I have begun educating myself, I have kept a daily log of my symptoms, what I eat, exercise, and I show the Endo my log with my (what I think is pretty extensive) list of symptoms. Even if my labs are normal, which in itself is bizarre given the way I am feeling this year compared to the previous 28 of my life, why does he seem to not really want to get to the root of my symptoms? Am I playing a waiting game until things get worse? I just don't know what to do...is Synthroid going to help? I have absolutely no idea bout any medicines I am completely oblivious and I do not want to cause my body any harm. I am including my labs this time to see what you think...
10/14/09-
TSH-1.42
T3-3.4
T4-1.1

11/30/09-
TSH-1.75
T3-3.2
T4-1.2
ANTI THYROID PEROXIDASE- 331 
ANA TITER- HOMOGENOUS (POSITIVE)
ANA SCREEN POSITIVE

WORST SYPMTOMS:
-NO RESTLESS SLEEP-WAKE UP EVERY MORNING LIKE MAC TRUCK HIT ME
-HAIR SHEDDING FOR ABOUT A YEAR, ABOUT 50% THINNER, VERY VERY DRY AND SPLIT ENDS
-TAKES A LONG TIME TO 'RECOVER" FROM EXERCISE OR EVEN GOING OUT WITH FRIENDS
-FORGET EVERYTHING, EVEN EASY THINGS,FEEL DYSLEXIC (GETTING NUMBERS, LETTERS BACKWARDS OFTEN)
-CANNOT LOSE WEIGHT, DESPITE BEING ACTIVE, GYM 3 TIMES A WEEK, RAISING 5 KIDS
-VERTIGO, FULL SENSATIONS IN EARS AMD LOTS AND LOTS OF HEADACHES
-SWELLING COMES AND GOES IN HANDS, FEET AND EYES
-RECURRENT BOILS ON UPPER THIGHS, BUTTOCKS
-FIBRO TYPE PAINS (RHEUMY SAYS I PROB HAVE FIBROMYALGIA, BUT SENT ME TO ENDO FOR MORE COMPLETE DIAGNOSIS)
THE LIST GOES ON, BUT THESE ARE THE WORST THINGS.


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## Andros (Aug 26, 2009)

prettynikki5 said:


> no cycst, tailbone has just felt "bruised" when i use the tailbone pillow, it doesn't hurt. i really feel frail in general,like an old lady. My endo called me today (2days after biopsy) to tell me that he wasn't able to get enough material to get a good result. So he says he will monitor my nodules for growth by doing another ultrasound in 4 months. He has offered low dosage of Synthroid. I am put off by the fact that he tells me that my thyroid is enlarged and has the characteristics of hashimoto's but has yet to educate me on just what this disease is about, what to expect, what I need to do...isn't this important? When you go to the doctor and you have an illness, isn't he supposed to tell you how to treat, fix it? I feel so at a loss her because I did my part, I have begun educating myself, I have kept a daily log of my symptoms, what I eat, exercise, and I show the Endo my log with my (what I think is pretty extensive) list of symptoms. Even if my labs are normal, which in itself is bizarre given the way I am feeling this year compared to the previous 28 of my life, why does he seem to not really want to get to the root of my symptoms? Am I playing a waiting game until things get worse? I just don't know what to do...is Synthroid going to help? I have absolutely no idea bout any medicines I am completely oblivious and I do not want to cause my body any harm. I am including my labs this time to see what you think...
> 10/14/09-
> TSH-1.42
> T3-3.4
> ...


Okay; you definitely have autoimmune something as evidenced by the high titer of TPO (331) and evidence of ANA is "suggestive" also.

With TPO and ANA, that means only that you have autoimmune disease and that "any good" doctor would want to investigate this further by doing more "specific" tests.

Because of the TPO, you "may" have thyroid disease and of course we suspect that based on your clinical symptoms as well. But..................you were given only the "obligatory" tests. Even the T4 and T3 are antiquated to a certain degree.

Here are some tests that you should have and if it means changing doctors, I recommend that you do so.

The lab tests listed are helpful when it comes to sorting things out.

TSH, FREE T3, FREE T4, TPO (antimicrosomal antibodies), ANA (antinuclear antibodies), TSI (thyroid stimulating immunoglobulin) and Thyroglobulin Ab.

You can look all of the above up here so you know what they are for........
http://www.labtestsonline.org/

Also, since you do have a nodule, I definitely recommend a radioactive uptake scan to make sure you do not have cancer of the thyroid.

I am with you; I believe you have thyroid disease but we have to prove it in order for you to get some attention.


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## themainemom (Oct 9, 2009)

Just wanted you to know that I too have lots of symptoms, but my numbers are "normal", so no treatment for me. I have not worked since the end of September due to my symtoms. My main ones are anxiety (which was INTENSE in oct. that I attribute to a hyperthyroid flare up), fatigue, no appetite, weight loss, insomnia and FATIGUE. Fatigue is the one that I continue to feel the most. I do mostly nothing and always feel like I want to lay down and curl up in a ball. I have been to many doctors appts, but alas, my numbers are "normal". Just want you to know I feel you pain and FRUSTRATION. I know what it feel like to constantly thing/say "I JUST WANT TO FEEL NORMAL!"


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## prettynikki5 (Dec 9, 2009)

Thank you for your support ) Wow,this is a really crazy disease! So what is the deal with so many symptoms, yet normal labs? Makes no sense...my body feels so alien to me now...so you too feel like you have hyper "flare-ups"? I feel this way too as some times I have hypo symptoms, then other times I feel like I have hyper syptoms, I also have the anxiety, I have always bit my nails, but the past couple months I don't know how I even have fingers left! LOL! I have "fat" and "skinny" weeks, and i am either "going" constantly or not much at all. Your doctor won't treat you at all? How is it possible to have a disease that doctor's refuse to treat people?! It's like saying "Hey your cancer is not really that bad yet, let's wait and see what happens to you". Wow. My doc has offered Synthroid. And I have no idea what good that stuff is...but also he has yet to explain this disease to me and the effects it has on my body. Good thing me and Google are best buds )


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## themainemom (Oct 9, 2009)

I have no doctors explain symptoms to me. Some have validated some of my symptoms saying they are part of what's going on and sometimes they say "you should not be feeling that with normal numbers". My mom was very angy when she heard that I have a "disease" but no one willing to treat. Everything I have learned has been from my own reasearch either on google or books.


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## prettynikki5 (Dec 9, 2009)

So, I have been thinking and thinking and more thinking...
I have a few questions, anyone feel free to chime in, they are very random...lol

1) I have read that Sleep Apnea is a "symptom" of Thyroid disease. Does anyone have this as a symptom? Also how long into the disease does this usually appear? One more thing-Does thyroid replacement meds alleviate this problem or are there additional meds to be taken?

2) Is it possible to know or find out how long you have had this disease?

3) Synthroid vs. Armour-which is better, is it beneficial to have the T3 AND T4? Does it make much of a difference to have both as opposed to just one? Anybody else on meds with very normal TSH, T3 & T4 levels?

4) Can levels "appear" normal at some point in the disease when you are really sick?

5) And lastly...is there a way to naturally go into remission, by changing diet? Is there something we eat or drink such as artificial sweeteners, that can cause thyroid issues? Is there a way to prevent it from becoming worse?

Any input, ideas, experiences greatly needed!
Thank you for your time and for reading )


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## Andros (Aug 26, 2009)

prettynikki5 said:


> So, I have been thinking and thinking and more thinking...
> I have a few questions, anyone feel free to chime in, they are very random...lol
> 
> 1) I have read that Sleep Apnea is a "symptom" of Thyroid disease. Does anyone have this as a symptom? Also how long into the disease does this usually appear? One more thing-Does thyroid replacement meds alleviate this problem or are there additional meds to be taken?
> ...


1. Most definitely sleep apnea is a symptom for some persons. I know I was one of those persons and once I was treated and feeling better having reached euthryoid status (normal); no more sleep apnea. And for the first time in years, I started dreaming again.

2. As you know, autoimmune is lying dormant. The only way to know when it specifically manifested it's self would be strictly dependent on how good your memory might be OR, query those closest to you as well to see if they can narrow the time line as to when they might have noticed a change in you.

3. It makes a difference if you are not converting. I find that most people w their gland intact or ever a partial gland do well on T4 only and that those who have no thyroid gland do not go through the conversion process (T4 to T3) well at all and therefore benefit from Armour or the addition of Cytomel to the t4 supplementation.

4. Absolutely. It all depends on what the antibodies are doing. That is why if the patient is looking good on the thyroid panel (TSH, FT3 and FT4) but not showing improvement, antibodies should be run. Usually suppressing the TSH keept the antibodies very quiet.

5. There are things that aggravate the condition so cleaning up the diet and life-style really go a long way to quality of life but I don't think it would be possible to go permanently into remission. Maybe for a while but it does not take long for the antibodies to rear their ugly heads and find a way around what you are doing. That has been my personal observation. I am not saying it is not possible, only that I think it not possible.


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## prettynikki5 (Dec 9, 2009)

Andros, you amaze me with your knowlege ) Thanks AGAIN for your time.

What's interesting to me is your comment about being able to dream again once the sleep apnea was under control, with me it is the opposite....I dream as though I am pregnant, but worse...lol! I have at least 2 or more dreams every single night, and I recall all of them. Last night for example, I freaked myself out as well as my partner when I woke up hyperventalating and sweating and looking at him like he was crazy. I feel like I am going completely mad! I spend my nights on one adventure after another and I wake up more exhausted than when I laid down, this has been since late spring. I am SEVERELY sleep deprived, memory is shot, body is officially on strike!LOL! My sleep study consult is on the 24th, I cannot wait...I am thinking I should have my son do a sleep study too as he wakes all through the night and has many vivid dreams that wake him, I know if I feel this bad without sleep, maybe he does too ( Sorry to ramble, It's confusing because you hear that you "dream" when you are in a deep sleep(REM?) but I never achieve that deep sleep, or so it feels like, yet I am sleeping harder than ever before, good thing I am not having to wake up with a newborn anymore, that would be rough!

I am all too familiar with autoimmune disease, My sister's immune system attacked her kidneys into failure, is that basically what is happening to my thyroid? Am I hearing you right, that the best thing to do is "trick" my immune system and supress my TSH as much as possible? I wonder, since I am not (by my labs) hypothyroid, if all my symptoms are purely autoimmune reaction to what my immune system is doing to my thyroid? I sure wish I had a doctor to explain all these things to me, sometimes it seems that even though they know all this information, they forget that WE DON'T, so it would be nice to share...lol!


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## Andros (Aug 26, 2009)

prettynikki5 said:


> Andros, you amaze me with your knowlege ) Thanks AGAIN for your time.
> 
> What's interesting to me is your comment about being able to dream again once the sleep apnea was under control, with me it is the opposite....I dream as though I am pregnant, but worse...lol! I have at least 2 or more dreams every single night, and I recall all of them. Last night for example, I freaked myself out as well as my partner when I woke up hyperventalating and sweating and looking at him like he was crazy. I feel like I am going completely mad! I spend my nights on one adventure after another and I wake up more exhausted than when I laid down, this has been since late spring. I am SEVERELY sleep deprived, memory is shot, body is officially on strike!LOL! My sleep study consult is on the 24th, I cannot wait...I am thinking I should have my son do a sleep study too as he wakes all through the night and has many vivid dreams that wake him, I know if I feel this bad without sleep, maybe he does too ( Sorry to ramble, It's confusing because you hear that you "dream" when you are in a deep sleep(REM?) but I never achieve that deep sleep, or so it feels like, yet I am sleeping harder than ever before, good thing I am not having to wake up with a newborn anymore, that would be rough!
> 
> I am all too familiar with autoimmune disease, My sister's immune system attacked her kidneys into failure, is that basically what is happening to my thyroid? Am I hearing you right, that the best thing to do is "trick" my immune system and supress my TSH as much as possible? I wonder, since I am not (by my labs) hypothyroid, if all my symptoms are purely autoimmune reaction to what my immune system is doing to my thyroid? I sure wish I had a doctor to explain all these things to me, sometimes it seems that even though they know all this information, they forget that WE DON'T, so it would be nice to share...lol!


With the endocrine system, if on system goes into failure, the others follow to a certain degree. The dreaming has to do w/ the pineal gland, melatonin, serotonin and of course REM.

In a way, I am glad that you are having the sleep study because something could be going on that we don't know about. Not everything is attributable to thyroid disease even though at times we think so.

Yes; that is a "trick" pony that works most of the time re suppressing the TSH. It keep my Lupus very very inactive (Anti-DNA) and by the way, does your sis have Lupus??? Is she okay now or is she on dialysis? What?

High titers of antibodies do cause the patient to be very "symptomatic" even though the thyroid panel comes in in range. Definitely yes!


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## prettynikki5 (Dec 9, 2009)

That is what my endo said, he will not treat me further for Hashi's until after my sleep study. Do you think the small amount of Synthroid would be effective in supressing my TSH? Hmmm...Very helpful info.

My sister went on dialysis, eventually, yes. She lost the battle in Nov. 07 at 22 yrs old. She passed in her sleep of heart failure. She did not have lupus.

I will be sure to let you know what my sleep study reveals, I am so anxious, I am craving "real" sleep something fierce.

Thanks again Andros! Every little bit of info and support helps <3


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## Andros (Aug 26, 2009)

prettynikki5 said:


> That is what my endo said, he will not treat me further for Hashi's until after my sleep study. Do you think the small amount of Synthroid would be effective in supressing my TSH? Hmmm...Very helpful info.
> 
> My sister went on dialysis, eventually, yes. She lost the battle in Nov. 07 at 22 yrs old. She passed in her sleep of heart failure. She did not have lupus.
> 
> ...


Oh, what a terrible story. I am so so sorry for the loss of your sister. So young.

Well; you would have to lab every 8 weeks to follow the suppression of the TSH and titrate thyroxine as needed in small increments. Not sure a small amount would do it. They have to do this with thyroid cancer patients and of course you know by now that my immunologist "sees" that as well so you should not have any trouble finding a doctor to work w/ you on this.

God bless you and your family.


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## prettynikki5 (Dec 9, 2009)

Hello! Checking in )
I had my sleep study consult Christmas Eve...by the way Merry Christmas and Happy New Year,many many blessings and healing thoughts and prayers to all !!!
The sleep doc looked me over and he noticed my new, fashionable goiter ( Blah...it seems to be growing, as if it has been aggravated by all the recent attention. Doc also showed me a chart of different pictures of the open area of the throat when one sticks out their tongue, mine is a small sliver of open airway...has my tongue GROWN?! What the heck is going on here??? Good gracious...so I am scheduled to go in on the 10th where as I will sleep all night hooked to wires etc, and if I stop breathing more than so many times per hour they will put a CPAP mask on my face-which I hate. Doc suspects I have Obstructive Sleep Apnea or something like that, basically something is stopping me from breathing-hence, no sleep. I really think I just need to have them take my thyroid out, then maybe I can sleep again. I am starting to get angry, haven't been going to the gym lately either because I am feeling so down I don't want to be around people because then I have to be fake happy and I can't do that right now, too much on my mind. Plus when I am not going to the gym my joints/muscles don't hurt! This is crazy. I have also come across some other info about Synthroid being really bad for you, because it only contains T4 and Armour has all the T hormones and is natural, any thoughts or experiences with this??? I really am just in awe of the fact that I have so many HYPO symptoms, some the same as people with TSH of 8+ , yet mine is only 1.75. I am also thinking after having 5 babies, I may have had thyroid issues on and off the past 10 years and never knew it...but at this point and I would think that my TSH would be though the roof, yet it is fine...okay, I am rambling ) One more thing, my right eye is having muscle spasms alot now....geez...cannot we boycott this disease?!


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## Andros (Aug 26, 2009)

prettynikki5 said:


> Hello! Checking in )
> I had my sleep study consult Christmas Eve...by the way Merry Christmas and Happy New Year,many many blessings and healing thoughts and prayers to all !!!
> The sleep doc looked me over and he noticed my new, fashionable goiter ( Blah...it seems to be growing, as if it has been aggravated by all the recent attention. Doc also showed me a chart of different pictures of the open area of the throat when one sticks out their tongue, mine is a small sliver of open airway...has my tongue GROWN?! What the heck is going on here??? Good gracious...so I am scheduled to go in on the 10th where as I will sleep all night hooked to wires etc, and if I stop breathing more than so many times per hour they will put a CPAP mask on my face-which I hate. Doc suspects I have Obstructive Sleep Apnea or something like that, basically something is stopping me from breathing-hence, no sleep. I really think I just need to have them take my thyroid out, then maybe I can sleep again. I am starting to get angry, haven't been going to the gym lately either because I am feeling so down I don't want to be around people because then I have to be fake happy and I can't do that right now, too much on my mind. Plus when I am not going to the gym my joints/muscles don't hurt! This is crazy. I have also come across some other info about Synthroid being really bad for you, because it only contains T4 and Armour has all the T hormones and is natural, any thoughts or experiences with this??? I really am just in awe of the fact that I have so many HYPO symptoms, some the same as people with TSH of 8+ , yet mine is only 1.75. I am also thinking after having 5 babies, I may have had thyroid issues on and off the past 10 years and never knew it...but at this point and I would think that my TSH would be though the roof, yet it is fine...okay, I am rambling ) One more thing, my right eye is having muscle spasms alot now....geez...cannot we boycott this disease?!


Macroglossia (enlarged tongue) is not unheard of with thyroid disease. It happened to me as well.

The thing about the TSH is that it has to be in a place that is right for you and that also includes the FREE T4 and the FREE T3. All three of these have to be just right (euthyroid.)

You would know you need Armour or other T3 supplementation "if" your FREE T3 is in the basement while you are on T4 supplementation.

So.............have you had the above tests?

It is so good to hear from you though and it would not surprise me that your airway is obstructed by a goiter and macroglossia.

So, you will please have to let us know what the results of the sleep study are.

You may also be electrolyte deficient and I don't mean just potassium. Many of us with TD are. I have to take a complete supplement of electrolytes daily and I do work out.........hard. Prior to discovering I needed electrolytes, I was in severe pain and had painful muscle spasms all the time. Consider this.


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## prettynikki5 (Dec 9, 2009)

These are the tests I have had so far:
10/14/09-
TSH-1.42
T3-3.4
T4-1.1

11/30/09-
TSH-1.75
T3-3.2
T4-1.2
ANTI THYROID PEROXIDASE- 331 
ANA TITER- HOMOGENOUS (POSITIVE)
ANA SCREEN POSITIVE

Are these "T" tests not the "Free T's"? Are those different? Do I need to request these also? I know you also said to request these other tests to be done :TPO (antimicrosomal antibodies), ANA (antinuclear antibodies), TSI (thyroid stimulating immunoglobulin) and Thyroglobulin Ab. Why wouldn't my doc have suggested any of these tests? Do you think these would perhaps explain why my TSH looks so normal, yet I am so symptomatic? Why wouldn't he think of this? I think he is a pretty good doc, I am new to this, so I cannot be sure, but I think it is a pretty smart call for him to hold off on treatment until AFTER the sleep study to determine which sypmtoms are related to the Sleep Apnea, however, why is he treating them as seperate ailments, when more than likely the thyroid is the root PROBLEM to the Apnea, and not do further testing on my thyroid? Does he not get that they are related? Even I can figure that out...maybe I need a woman doc? From what I hear, many men docs blow us off as hormonal, depressed or whatever. Will doctors generally remove the thyroid at the patients' request? Maybe that will just be the best thing since it is such a pain, and then there would be nothing left to "attack"


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## Andros (Aug 26, 2009)

prettynikki5 said:


> These are the tests I have had so far:
> 10/14/09-
> TSH-1.42
> T3-3.4
> ...


Totals are bound and unbound plus rT3 and rT4 (reverse) hormone so how do we know how much (what percentage) is unbound? Unbound is what is available for cellular uptake. So, the FREES are exactly that, the free (unbound)portion available for cellular uptake.

And you do have ANA which should tell you doctor that he needs to do more in-depth antibodies testing such as the one's I mentioned. The presence of ANA is "suggestive", it is rarely if ever "definitive."

Please read this in it's entirety............

http://www.labtestsonline.org/understanding/analytes/ana/test.html

I did not want to say but I think the sleep study is just something your insurance will pay for and your doc is taking advantage of that. He really should refer you out but you can do that yourself.

It is not the gender that is important, it is the person that is. I have had some female doctors that were so condescending you would not believe it. Real *****es if you will excuse the terminology.

You must find a doctor that cares about you. Bottom line. There were times in my own life where my veterinarian was more helpful and knowledgable to me than any doctor was and I kid you not. I am totally serious.

I am worried about you and I wish I was there to help you find a compassionate and knowledgable doctor. But...........I am not. So you must advocate for yourself and we (all of us) can help you do that. Don't give up.


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## prettynikki5 (Dec 9, 2009)

Andros, you are the best!! I don't want any worrying going on  Just trying to make sense of all the madness...lol! I know there is hope if someone like you can have such a share of hardships and still share your positive outlook, and healing words...and make us smile  About the veterenarian..lol..I hear you , I have a doggy and kitty and I swear they are some great docs aren't they?? Maybe, they need to send people doctors to vet school AFTER they complete med school, whaddaya think?! Heehee  I'm am starting the petition...
Actually, the rhuemy referred me to the sleep doc. My endo, thinks most if not all my symptoms are coming from that, becuase, one look at my labs tells him that I am not having symptoms from my thyroid, Can't be, which I think is why when he felt it was large and then found the nodules (this all on my first visit to him) he seemed (to me) worried and wanted to do that biopsy pretty quickly (I was thinking he was saying my symptoms were something more like thyroid cancer or something), then when the biopsy was a fluke "not enough material" and he shrugged it off "we'll monitor it again in about 4 mos. or so to check for growth" I was appalled. So yeah, he says call him after I get my sleep study results...blah. I am going to read that article you linked me, and ask that he do those tests when I call him with my sleep study results. I will re-think the lady doctor thing...
Many thanks


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## Andros (Aug 26, 2009)

prettynikki5 said:


> Andros, you are the best!! I don't want any worrying going on  Just trying to make sense of all the madness...lol! I know there is hope if someone like you can have such a share of hardships and still share your positive outlook, and healing words...and make us smile  About the veterenarian..lol..I hear you , I have a doggy and kitty and I swear they are some great docs aren't they?? Maybe, they need to send people doctors to vet school AFTER they complete med school, whaddaya think?! Heehee  I'm am starting the petition...
> Actually, the rhuemy referred me to the sleep doc. My endo, thinks most if not all my symptoms are coming from that, becuase, one look at my labs tells him that I am not having symptoms from my thyroid, Can't be, which I think is why when he felt it was large and then found the nodules (this all on my first visit to him) he seemed (to me) worried and wanted to do that biopsy pretty quickly (I was thinking he was saying my symptoms were something more like thyroid cancer or something), then when the biopsy was a fluke "not enough material" and he shrugged it off "we'll monitor it again in about 4 mos. or so to check for growth" I was appalled. So yeah, he says call him after I get my sleep study results...blah. I am going to read that article you linked me, and ask that he do those tests when I call him with my sleep study results. I will re-think the lady doctor thing...
> Many thanks


Thanks for the update! And you are welcome. If I am helping, that makes my heart smile.

Enlarged thyroid (goiter) and nodules = thyroid disease. Focus on that.

I do hope you can get those other tests run and once again, I will be anxious about the sleep study and the results.

Happy New Year to you and yours!


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## prettynikki5 (Dec 9, 2009)

Sleep Study Mission Accomplished  Waited one week for results and NO sleep apnea, Yay! Actually my study showed I slept very well. This was good news for me, as the whole 'not breathing' thing really freaks me out  So the unrefreshing sleep has another cause. Someone I know who is fairly up to speed on my "condition" and diagnosis (Hashi's) stated to me that they think it is all just an "allergy" of some sort. That really stuck in my mind and for almost this entire past week I have been researching like crazy about this possibility. I think I have found the answer. Candida! This is directly linked to and causes Hashi's from what I have found,also all of my "unexplained" symptoms that do not match my lab results. (Not Hypo yet) . I have been battling yeast and UTI's and other infections of the sort my whole life. My children all nursed from me and 3 of my 5 had thrush/yeast infections as babies. I had NO IDEA about this horrible stuff that actually can become SYSTEMIC and virtually affects the entire body. I spit in a glass of water yesterday morning and VIOLA! YEAST CITY! Ewwww  My children as well, same thing, although not as much and as bad as mine. The overgrowth of Candida causes an "autoimmune response" from the body (my + ANA). Maybe this is truly what is wrong with us? My doctor has no idea, but is ready to give me Synthroid. That makes no sense to me at all. I ordered a probiotic (Threelac) and I intend to fully overhaul our food supply, re-think the way our family is eating (our way to sickness/death apparently)and get everyone healty again, the natural way. NO WONDER I need sugars and startches around the clock or I am miserable. I am feeding this monster inside me. It is going to be so hard to adjust to this whole new way of eating, preparing foods and shopping for them, but I am up for the challenge. I feel like this really is going to be a healing process for us all. I am excited to feel good again, and my children are plagued with all types of things that get worse over time(ADHD-like behavior) chronic sinus issues, eczema,weight issues, fatigue, "brain fog" and so on  All these things I have read are related to Candida. I wonder why this wasn't considered along with the bazillion tests 3 different doctors ordered up for me? Anyone else hear of Candida and have any thoughts, or suggestions about it?


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## Andros (Aug 26, 2009)

prettynikki5 said:


> Sleep Study Mission Accomplished  Waited one week for results and NO sleep apnea, Yay! Actually my study showed I slept very well. This was good news for me, as the whole 'not breathing' thing really freaks me out  So the unrefreshing sleep has another cause. Someone I know who is fairly up to speed on my "condition" and diagnosis (Hashi's) stated to me that they think it is all just an "allergy" of some sort. That really stuck in my mind and for almost this entire past week I have been researching like crazy about this possibility. I think I have found the answer. Candida! This is directly linked to and causes Hashi's from what I have found,also all of my "unexplained" symptoms that do not match my lab results. (Not Hypo yet) . I have been battling yeast and UTI's and other infections of the sort my whole life. My children all nursed from me and 3 of my 5 had thrush/yeast infections as babies. I had NO IDEA about this horrible stuff that actually can become SYSTEMIC and virtually affects the entire body. I spit in a glass of water yesterday morning and VIOLA! YEAST CITY! Ewwww  My children as well, same thing, although not as much and as bad as mine. The overgrowth of Candida causes an "autoimmune response" from the body (my + ANA). Maybe this is truly what is wrong with us? My doctor has no idea, but is ready to give me Synthroid. That makes no sense to me at all. I ordered a probiotic (Threelac) and I intend to fully overhaul our food supply, re-think the way our family is eating (our way to sickness/death apparently)and get everyone healty again, the natural way. NO WONDER I need sugars and startches around the clock or I am miserable. I am feeding this monster inside me. It is going to be so hard to adjust to this whole new way of eating, preparing foods and shopping for them, but I am up for the challenge. I feel like this really is going to be a healing process for us all. I am excited to feel good again, and my children are plagued with all types of things that get worse over time(ADHD-like behavior) chronic sinus issues, eczema,weight issues, fatigue, "brain fog" and so on  All these things I have read are related to Candida. I wonder why this wasn't considered along with the bazillion tests 3 different doctors ordered up for me? Anyone else hear of Candida and have any thoughts, or suggestions about it?


I am really glad to hear that you do not have sleep apnea. Not glad to hear about the Candida though. Yes; you must adress this situation forthwith and it won't be easy. Your diet will be very limited. Can you do this? Yes you can.

In the process, I would urge you to not lose site of the fact that you do have nodules. It would be my humble opinion that you should take the Synthroid as it will help shrink the nodules and may help you heal faster from all the things that are attacking your immune system.

Whole body health in other words.


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## prettynikki5 (Dec 9, 2009)

Thank you Andros. My doctor prescribed 50mcg of Synthroid yesterday. I am going to p/u the medicine today. I am just so worried about taking medicine  I don't want to make anything worse. I suppose since I already have the nodules, that I HAVE to take meds now? Is this even after I get the Candida under control too? My doctor scheduled me to come back in two months to see how I am feeling on the Synthroid and to retake labs. Another thing too, my doctor said (well his nurse told me on his behalf)that it is normal for my goiter to change size. Some days it is really big and noticeble, other days it's almost normal size. Do you know what causes this and is it okay?


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## Andros (Aug 26, 2009)

prettynikki5 said:


> Thank you Andros. My doctor prescribed 50mcg of Synthroid yesterday. I am going to p/u the medicine today. I am just so worried about taking medicine  I don't want to make anything worse. I suppose since I already have the nodules, that I HAVE to take meds now? Is this even after I get the Candida under control too? My doctor scheduled me to come back in two months to see how I am feeling on the Synthroid and to retake labs. Another thing too, my doctor said (well his nurse told me on his behalf)that it is normal for my goiter to change size. Some days it is really big and noticeble, other days it's almost normal size. Do you know what causes this and is it okay?


Yes; the goiter engorges and disengorges. Quite the conundrum and I am not quite sure what might cause this except for vascularity.

See, taking the Synthoid is going to help you get the Candida under control and vice versa. All things work together. If one system fails, others follow suit.

I never viewed my thyroxine replacement as medicine. I view it as a life-sustaining supplement that I must have in order to feel well and maintain the status quo. And yes, you probably will take it for the rest of your life. That is the "usual" format.

8 weeks for labs is a good routine. I like that. Your doc has a handle on this.


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## prettynikki5 (Dec 9, 2009)

He has a good handle on it? Yay! I am glad to hear you think so. I am so worried. I read so many horrible things that people have gone through (I couldn't imagine). My heart truly goes out to every one of you. I started the Synthroid Saturday. 50mcg. I didn't realize it was more of a supplement than a medicine. I hope I do okay on this. Day one of Candida diet. I sooo miss my coffee  really has become my buddy since my lack of sleep began late spring last year. I have been sipping hot pomegranete green tea all day (YUM!) My coworkers had cheesecake and chocolate dipped strawberries, I had an apple. How dreadful..lol!


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## Andros (Aug 26, 2009)

prettynikki5 said:


> He has a good handle on it? Yay! I am glad to hear you think so. I am so worried. I read so many horrible things that people have gone through (I couldn't imagine). My heart truly goes out to every one of you. I started the Synthroid Saturday. 50mcg. I didn't realize it was more of a supplement than a medicine. I hope I do okay on this. Day one of Candida diet. I sooo miss my coffee  really has become my buddy since my lack of sleep began late spring last year. I have been sipping hot pomegranete green tea all day (YUM!) My coworkers had cheesecake and chocolate dipped strawberries, I had an apple. How dreadful..lol!


That tea sounds really really good. I have 2 to 3 apples a day. I "love" apples and they are so so good for you!

What your co-workers ate is dreadful!!:anim_63:

How are you feeling?


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## prettynikki5 (Dec 9, 2009)

Oh yes! When I start feeling really down and wanting something sweet, I remember the apples in the fridge and my heart leaps! LOL! They are delicious and they really satisfy the cravings well. I will be so so glad when I don't crave sugar like this anymore. I am actually feeling really good. I am on a very strict candida diet, taking Threelac once a day, and the daily tab of 50mcg Synthroid. I accidentally ate RIGHT AFTER I took my tab this am  So does that mean it didn't get absorbed? I am not sure which of any of these things is making me feel better, probably the combo. I feel more alert, less tired, more energy, and I have been in a GOOD MOOD! I notice that even after I do get upset or angry I do not dwell on it as much, I am able to "get over it quickly" and put a smile back on  This is the nicest change so far. It has only been a few days,I didn't expect to feel any different so soon. I believe my body is talking to me and it is saying "THANK YOU!"  Only bad thing is I have a pain now 2 days in the middle of my chest. Any clue what this may be? Happy Hump Day!!!


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## Andros (Aug 26, 2009)

prettynikki5 said:


> Oh yes! When I start feeling really down and wanting something sweet, I remember the apples in the fridge and my heart leaps! LOL! They are delicious and they really satisfy the cravings well. I will be so so glad when I don't crave sugar like this anymore. I am actually feeling really good. I am on a very strict candida diet, taking Threelac once a day, and the daily tab of 50mcg Synthroid. I accidentally ate RIGHT AFTER I took my tab this am  So does that mean it didn't get absorbed? I am not sure which of any of these things is making me feel better, probably the combo. I feel more alert, less tired, more energy, and I have been in a GOOD MOOD! I notice that even after I do get upset or angry I do not dwell on it as much, I am able to "get over it quickly" and put a smile back on  This is the nicest change so far. It has only been a few days,I didn't expect to feel any different so soon. I believe my body is talking to me and it is saying "THANK YOU!"  Only bad thing is I have a pain now 2 days in the middle of my chest. Any clue what this may be? Happy Hump Day!!!


Boy, am I glad to hear all of the above. With taking your thyroxine, one must be consistant. If you eat after you take it (I do) then it will titrated accordingly.

Pain in the sternum? Could be an inflammatory process such as costalchondritis which I used to get all the time really bad. So, I hope it is not that.


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## prettynikki5 (Dec 9, 2009)

UPDATE!!! Pain in the chest not here today. I have read that can be a symptom of Candida "die off" Hmmm...The good news is NO MORE TAILBONE PAIN!!! I've had no pain there all week! This seems like such a small thing, but something so small has really been a pain in the rear, literally! LOL! It's gone! Not sure if from the Probiotic/Candida diet or the Synthroid is the source of my relief, I wish I knew-hard to tell with 2 new things at going on the same time. Also, I went ot the gym last night and felt super weak during my Aerobics class, but I was sweating more than ever. Normally, my face is very red and I hardly sweat at all. I am glad to be sweating, I am sure that is a good thing  So, that is all. I just had to share my small victory! Hope everyone is having a nice Thursday


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## Andros (Aug 26, 2009)

prettynikki5 said:


> UPDATE!!! Pain in the chest not here today. I have read that can be a symptom of Candida "die off" Hmmm...The good news is NO MORE TAILBONE PAIN!!! I've had no pain there all week! This seems like such a small thing, but something so small has really been a pain in the rear, literally! LOL! It's gone! Not sure if from the Probiotic/Candida diet or the Synthroid is the source of my relief, I wish I knew-hard to tell with 2 new things at going on the same time. Also, I went ot the gym last night and felt super weak during my Aerobics class, but I was sweating more than ever. Normally, my face is very red and I hardly sweat at all. I am glad to be sweating, I am sure that is a good thing  So, that is all. I just had to share my small victory! Hope everyone is having a nice Thursday


Oh, yea!!! This is terrific and I had not thought about the Candida causing that kind of pain. Yes; with 2 new things, it is kind of hard to be a good scientist but I am glad you are doing both because I think this goes hand in hand really. You know your thyroid hormones support the immune system and when that is down, the Candida easily can set in again.

Sweating is good. I remember the same thing happening to me many years ago when I got on thyroxine for the first time. You may also notice an odor. Those nasty toxins coming out. I could not believe it for I had not perspired for many many years and all of a sudden, I was drenched.

And by the way, I think this is a huge victory!arty0006:

Let's do the Snoopy Dance........... http://www.darkharbor.com/snoopydance/


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## prettynikki5 (Dec 9, 2009)

Ha ha!!! I Love it! I am doing the Snoopy Dance


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## Andros (Aug 26, 2009)

Andros said:


> Oh, yea!!! This is terrific and I had not thought about the Candida causing that kind of pain. Yes; with 2 new things, it is kind of hard to be a good scientist but I am glad you are doing both because I think this goes hand in hand really. You know your thyroid hormones support the immune system and when that is down, the Candida easily can set in again.
> 
> Sweating is good. I remember the same thing happening to me many years ago when I got on thyroxine for the first time. You may also notice an odor. Those nasty toxins coming out. I could not believe it for I had not perspired for many many years and all of a sudden, I was drenched.
> 
> ...


That is good because smiles make us feel better too!


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## prettynikki5 (Dec 9, 2009)

Update time 
I like to inform everyone reading, I find it super helpful if not just comforting when I read everyone else's stories!
Follow up visit to Endo after 8 weeks on 50mcg of Synthroid. TSH checked only (1.8) wich was about where it has been the past 6 months, so still NORMAL. WE talked about how the Synthroid made me feel, if it had helped or not, I told him it has helped tremendously : Clearer thinking,more restful sleep,no more headaches, joint and muscle aches, no carpal tunnel pain,tail bone pain much much better,no hives, less anxiety, less mood swings and happier disposition over all, periods are regular again,and for the 1st 6 wweks my goiter was non-existant. I explained that the goiter has been back the past 2 weeks or so and I haven't felt as great (still nothing close to as bad as before Synthroid) and he increased my dose to 75 mcg a day. I am glad we were on the same page because this was my thought going into my appt. That I just needed a "bit" more to supress these pesky antibodies. Doc said "Whatever works, with your levels being normal, yet you still have these symptoms-we are taking a shot in the dark". I love it. My next follow up in June he will draw labs again and Ultrasound my nodules for growth. I think this was a successful visit, goiter is going back down again (hope it stays that way!-can you sense the goiter hate vibes??!! LOL) I also asked the doc where Hashi's comes from, the root cause so to speak, he said it's probably part of my genetic make up and something such as stress, trauma, or the enviornment triggered the antibodies to attack and somehow they included my thyroid in the process. 
Happy weekend everyone!!!


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## daisy_ysiad2002 (Aug 17, 2009)

not sure..you could google chelation therapy and go from there if it is something that interests you. Its a method to rid your body of toxins...my sis doctor/thyroid doctor among other things he fixes does this. She has to get it done as she used to have silver filling in her teeth removed. Its amazing what can affects our thyroid and bodies including aspartame that seems to be in alot of foods


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## Andros (Aug 26, 2009)

prettynikki5 said:


> Update time
> I like to inform everyone reading, I find it super helpful if not just comforting when I read everyone else's stories!
> Follow up visit to Endo after 8 weeks on 50mcg of Synthroid. TSH checked only (1.8) wich was about where it has been the past 6 months, so still NORMAL. WE talked about how the Synthroid made me feel, if it had helped or not, I told him it has helped tremendously : Clearer thinking,more restful sleep,no more headaches, joint and muscle aches, no carpal tunnel pain,tail bone pain much much better,no hives, less anxiety, less mood swings and happier disposition over all, periods are regular again,and for the 1st 6 wweks my goiter was non-existant. I explained that the goiter has been back the past 2 weeks or so and I haven't felt as great (still nothing close to as bad as before Synthroid) and he increased my dose to 75 mcg a day. I am glad we were on the same page because this was my thought going into my appt. That I just needed a "bit" more to supress these pesky antibodies. Doc said "Whatever works, with your levels being normal, yet you still have these symptoms-we are taking a shot in the dark". I love it. My next follow up in June he will draw labs again and Ultrasound my nodules for growth. I think this was a successful visit, goiter is going back down again (hope it stays that way!-can you sense the goiter hate vibes??!! LOL) I also asked the doc where Hashi's comes from, the root cause so to speak, he said it's probably part of my genetic make up and something such as stress, trauma, or the enviornment triggered the antibodies to attack and somehow they included my thyroid in the process.
> Happy weekend everyone!!!


How fortunate you are to have such a wonderful doctor and how fortunate we are to be able to share your healing process.

Thank you for posting such good news! This will offer hope to many who post here.

You also have a very very good attitude. That helps a lot.


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