# Extreme brain fog / memory problem



## Opus131

I've been experiencing problems with my mind for almost six years now. It first started with a lessening of my ability to feel emotions, or sensations in general. At the time, i wrote it off as being part of aging (i was 25 at the time), and even though it caused a lot depression i learned to cope with it. I then started to have memory problems, particularly after a bad drinking binge (i quit alcohol completely after that and i haven't had a single drop for years) coupled with several visual disturbances, such as clouded vision (similar to what you get when you stand in the sun for a while then walk inside, except in my case is a persistent condition) and visual snow. Then, came a deterioration of my general mental faculties, which has progressed almost imperceptibly in this past several years. I made various trips to doctors of all sorts, but nothing ever came out of it (one doctor even asked me if i was doing drugs). Now lately, all the above symptoms have been getting much, much worst. Because of my apathy and depression i somewhat let it slide, until two week ago, where my brain simply plunged itself into lala land. Its been two weeks now that i've been living in almost total darkness. Its like i'm completely cut off from the outside world. My thoughts are extremely faint, sensations are almost non-existent, and my general cognition is on an all time low. There is a marked difference between my previous issues, as bad as they were, with what i have now. Its like my mind is about to disappear. I swear if it gets worst then this i'll be comatose. Its like i'm living in a faint dream. Is this experience common to those who have brain fog? I mean, i hear people say things like they can't recognize familiar places or people. My cognition is generally still good in that regard, its just that my experience of the outside world and my own thoughts is extremely faint. Its the single most disturbing event of my life, and if this keeps up i don't think i may never function normally ever again. I can barely even watch TV as everything is so distant and it leaves no impression in my mind. Even posting this feels like i'm a place far, far away and i have to struggle to keep my train of thought, and i keep making silly mistakes which i have to correct over and over (i had this problem before too but nowhere near as bad as this).

Now, two weeks prior to this i had a case of swollen feet. I had to see a doctor who gave me a blood test, and apparently my thyroid function was on the low side. At the time i didn't though much about it since my brain was still relatively healthy and i didn't know a whole lot about thyroid, so i just brush it off. But now, after my brain fog worsened to such a degree, i thought back at my thyroid result, and among all the symptoms seems like brain fog is one of them. I'm now waiting for the result of a second test, but i'd like to ask a couple of questions:

1) Is my description of the mental disturbances of hypothyroidism in accordance to what i described here?

2) Does the fact that my thyroid levels are low in the test signify a certain case of hypothyroidism, with all that that implies (life long treatment and ever lasting symptoms ect. ect.)?

Other symptoms right now include dry skin, difficulties falling asleep (once i do i sleep like a baby though) and weight gain (i gained 23 pounds since my last visit, which was six weeks ago). I'm actually almost wishing this is a case of hypothyroidism because i've seen in this forum and else where that the fog may lift with treatment, as opposed to permanent brain injury, perhaps due undetected sleep apnea (never been tested for this, just read about it). The only time when i feel my fog lift a bit is when i'm not eating, which actually gives me some hope i may get better.


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## chopper

Hello,

From my own experience with a bum thyroid brain fog is more like a really bad hangover. Since you said you used to drink, remember the days where you walked in at 4 am and had to beat work by 8? 2 hours of sleep after 9 hours of drinking? Well that is sort of what bad "brain fog" is like.


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## Opus131

nasdaqphil said:


> Hello,
> 
> From my own experience with a bum thyroid brain fog is more like a really bad hangover. Since you said you used to drink, remember the days where you walked in at 4 am and had to beat work by 8? 2 hours of sleep after 9 hours of drinking? Well that is sort of what bad "brain fog" is like.


I remember getting hung over. This is much, much worst then that. It literally feels like my mind and the world are disappearing. Perhaps i have a worst case because my thyroid problems have been going for longer without being detected?

BTW, since this occurred, i've also been getting recurrent hot flashes on my left leg, you know, like when you are in a car right under a ray of sun. I don't know if this is related to anything.


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## Andros

Opus131 said:


> I've been experiencing problems with my mind for almost six years now. It first started with a lessening of my ability to feel emotions, or sensations in general. At the time, i wrote it off as being part of aging (i was 25 at the time), and even though it caused a lot depression i learned to cope with it. I then started to have memory problems, particularly after a bad drinking binge (i quit alcohol completely after that and i haven't had a single drop for years) coupled with several visual disturbances, such as clouded vision (similar to what you get when you stand in the sun for a while then walk inside, except in my case is a persistent condition) and visual snow. Then, came a deterioration of my general mental faculties, which has progressed almost imperceptibly in this past several years. I made various trips to doctors of all sorts, but nothing ever came out of it (one doctor even asked me if i was doing drugs). Now lately, all the above symptoms have been getting much, much worst. Because of my apathy and depression i somewhat let it slide, until two week ago, where my brain simply plunged itself into lala land. Its been two weeks now that i've been living in almost total darkness. Its like i'm completely cut off from the outside world. My thoughts are extremely faint, sensations are almost non-existent, and my general cognition is on an all time low. There is a marked difference between my previous issues, as bad as they were, with what i have now. Its like my mind is about to disappear. I swear if it gets worst then this i'll be comatose. Its like i'm living in a faint dream. Is this experience common to those who have brain fog? I mean, i hear people say things like they can't recognize familiar places or people. My cognition is generally still good in that regard, its just that my experience of the outside world and my own thoughts is extremely faint. Its the single most disturbing event of my life, and if this keeps up i don't think i may never function normally ever again. I can barely even watch TV as everything is so distant and it leaves no impression in my mind. Even posting this feels like i'm a place far, far away and i have to struggle to keep my train of thought, and i keep making silly mistakes which i have to correct over and over (i had this problem before too but nowhere near as bad as this).
> 
> Now, two weeks prior to this i had a case of swollen feet. I had to see a doctor who gave me a blood test, and apparently my thyroid function was on the low side. At the time i didn't though much about it since my brain was still relatively healthy and i didn't know a whole lot about thyroid, so i just brush it off. But now, after my brain fog worsened to such a degree, i thought back at my thyroid result, and among all the symptoms seems like brain fog is one of them. I'm now waiting for the result of a second test, but i'd like to ask a couple of questions:
> 
> 1) Is my description of the mental disturbances of hypothyroidism in accordance to what i described here?
> 
> 2) Does the fact that my thyroid levels are low in the test signify a certain case of hypothyroidism, with all that that implies (life long treatment and ever lasting symptoms ect. ect.)?
> 
> Other symptoms right now include dry skin, difficulties falling asleep (once i do i sleep like a baby though) and weight gain (i gained 23 pounds since my last visit, which was six weeks ago). I'm actually almost wishing this is a case of hypothyroidism because i've seen in this forum and else where that the fog may lift with treatment, as opposed to permanent brain injury, perhaps due undetected sleep apnea (never been tested for this, just read about it). The only time when i feel my fog lift a bit is when i'm not eating, which actually gives me some hope i may get better.


I am so glad you could finally post and welcome to our lovely little board.

Opus; yes, yes, yes. Many of the mental symptoms you describe and most assuredly be attributed to thyroid disease (untreated.) That would include, brain-fog, memory lapses, psychosis, apathy and disassociation.

The thyroid produces hormones upon receiving messages from the pituitary gland to do so. The thyroid produces T4 hormone and maybe a small amount of conversion to T3 takes place in the thyroid gland. Then the T4 guys have to get to the liver for the major conversion process of T4 to T3. T3 is your active hormone (Free T3) and interestingly, the limbic system of the brain is very dependent on this FT3 for good mental health.

Read this stuff if you will.................

Identifying hypothyroidism's psychiatric presentations

http://www.jfponline.com/Pages.asp?AID=4570

And, I will put the hyperthyroid one for you as we don't really know which one you are yet. Plus, others may wish to read this as well.

http://www.jfponline.com/Pages.asp?AID=4640

What tests did the doctor run and what were the results and ranges? We need the ranges as they differ from lab to lab. Are you to see the doctor for follow-up?

I sense you are in a bad place. Apathy would prevent you from advocating for yourself. Do you have someone who could help you at this time?

You did one good thing for yourself and that is you have quit drinking. Alcohol "seems" to really flip most of us w/ thyroid disease out. It is a metabolic thing and we no longer process like the normal person does. This decision means that you have not lost control of your mental faculties. No way.

Now, I hope you have a follow-up and if you do, you need antibodies' tests run such as TPO (antimicrosomal antibodies), TSI (thyroid stimulating immunoglobulin) and Thyroglobulin Ab. This is a good place to start and it might help you to print out what tests you need run.


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## thechadmanhl2

I feel your pain also. The mental part is the worst thing about a thyroid problem.

I forget huge things about my past, things i say, or things i do to people. its like i am living my life in the third person perspective most of the time. I find myself having to ask people "what?" or "excuse me?" all the time because i can literally not process the information given to me the first time. I cant even talk at times. i become a studdering idiot and even lose my balance at times. i become more clumsy and trip on my own feet and run into furniture because im walking around in this dazed state of mind. With my eye problems also i find myself with a blank stare like i am day dreaming all the time.

its 4 am and i am up posting on this forum because i am dealing with the insomnia associated with graves disease.

i have a hard time reading too. its not that i cant read, i have always been good at it, as a child i used to read for fun. Now it seems i either dont process the information i am reading, or my mind trails off and i start thinking about something else and realize im physically reading the book, but not mentally. This made school a nightmare for me. I used to be the over-achiver in class, the one everyone went to for help. since then my brain has seemed like it is deteriorating and i cant handle simple community college classes and i am an embarassment to my family and myself.

i feel your pain, and wish i could help. its actually good to know im not alone when it comes to this mental prison we have to deal with on a daily basis.


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## Andros

thechadmanhl2 said:


> I feel your pain also. The mental part is the worst thing about a thyroid problem.
> 
> I forget huge things about my past, things i say, or things i do to people. its like i am living my life in the third person perspective most of the time. I find myself having to ask people "what?" or "excuse me?" all the time because i can literally not process the information given to me the first time. I cant even talk at times. i become a studdering idiot and even lose my balance at times. i become more clumsy and trip on my own feet and run into furniture because im walking around in this dazed state of mind. With my eye problems also i find myself with a blank stare like i am day dreaming all the time.
> 
> its 4 am and i am up posting on this forum because i am dealing with the insomnia associated with graves disease.
> 
> i have a hard time reading too. its not that i cant read, i have always been good at it, as a child i used to read for fun. Now it seems i either dont process the information i am reading, or my mind trails off and i start thinking about something else and realize im physically reading the book, but not mentally. This made school a nightmare for me. I used to be the over-achiver in class, the one everyone went to for help. since then my brain has seemed like it is deteriorating and i cant handle simple community college classes and i am an embarassment to my family and myself.
> 
> i feel your pain, and wish i could help. its actually good to know im not alone when it comes to this mental prison we have to deal with on a daily basis.


You are so right; I could read an entire book (love to read) and not remember a word I read nor could I remember the title. LHM! (Lord have mercy!)

Welcome to the board!


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## Opus131

What about the faintness though? Anybody feeling like the world is starting to disappear?

I was under the impression that those mental symptoms would go away after starting treatment. Is this not the case for you guys? Should i not get my hopes up?


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## Andros

Opus131 said:


> What about the faintness though? Anybody feeling like the world is starting to disappear?
> 
> I was under the impression that those mental symptoms would go away after starting treatment. Is this not the case for you guys? Should i not get my hopes up?


The symptoms went away for me once I went ahead and had RAI (now considered hypothyroid), got on track with my thyroxine replacement and started to heal. I like to think I am as sharp as a tack now.

You should have your hopes up; by all means. If you are being treated for hypothyroidism, the "key" is to get you to the "euthyroid" state which is the normal state for you where you feel well. This involves much patience getting labs every 8 weeks and a slow but steady titration upward or downward as needed of your thyroxine replacement.

So, I hope you can work closely w/ your doctor on this one.


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## Opus131

Andros said:


> The symptoms went away for me once I went ahead and had RAI (now considered hypothyroid), got on track with my thyroxine replacement and started to heal. I like to think I am as sharp as a tack now.


But how bad were your cognitive deficits? The following article seems to indicate severe mental problems aren't as easily reversible:

http://archinte.ama-assn.org/cgi/content/full/158/13/1413

This is really starting to scare me and my anxiety levels are all over the place. I'm only 31 and i don't want to spend the rest of my life living with this levels of mental impairments. I mean, this isn't just a case of "forgetfulness" or "poor concentration". I'm currently living in a persistent state of altered consciousness where even partaking in simple things like reading a simple book and watching a movie becomes a struggle. I can't even chat on the internet without feeling severely impaired. This is too much.


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## Andros

Opus131 said:


> But how bad were your cognitive deficits? The following article seems to indicate severe mental problems aren't as easily reversible:
> 
> http://archinte.ama-assn.org/cgi/content/full/158/13/1413
> 
> This is really starting to scare me and my anxiety levels are all over the place. I'm only 31 and i don't want to spend the rest of my life living with this levels of mental impairments. I mean, this isn't just a case of "forgetfulness" or "poor concentration". I'm currently living in a persistent state of altered consciousness where even partaking in simple things like reading a simple book and watching a movie becomes a struggle. I can't even chat on the internet without feeling severely impaired. This is too much.


Holy cats; that is an awesome find. I have bookmarked that one. Thank you.

Well, I would be driving along and forget where I was going (it was only to work for Pete's sakes), would lose my sense of direction, I felt I was there but not there; sort of in limbo somewhere hovering over the earth, speech problems, not too fast on my feet in the thinking department, confused a lot, math ability plummeted..................just all sorts of things. I could not focus on things that required my undivided attention (short attention span.) Spatial problems, visual perception problems, lost all artistic and musical ablility.

It has been so long ago, I don't remember everything. I don't believe I have any permanent brain damage though. All appears well now.


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## Opus131

Andros said:


> Holy cats; that is an awesome find. I have bookmarked that one. Thank you.
> 
> Well, I would be driving along and forget where I was going (it was only to work for Pete's sakes), would lose my sense of direction, I felt I was there but not there; sort of in limbo somewhere hovering over the earth, speech problems, not too fast on my feet in the thinking department, confused a lot, math ability plummeted..................just all sorts of things. I could not focus on things that required my undivided attention (short attention span.) Spatial problems, visual perception problems, lost all artistic and musical ablility.
> 
> It has been so long ago, I don't remember everything. I don't believe I have any permanent brain damage though. All appears well now.


Well, i'm going to allow myself to have some hope, if anything because i have no choice on the matter. How long did it take you to notice an improvement in mental faculties after starting treatment?


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## Andros

Opus131 said:


> Well, i'm going to allow myself to have some hope, if anything because i have no choice on the matter. How long did it take you to notice an improvement in mental faculties after starting treatment?


It was slow go but I would say I was full bore physically and mentally in about 18 months. That is the "average" healing time.

As w/ any chronic disease, it is essential to have hope. Do whatever you can to keep a life-line going spiritualy, emotionally and otherwise. It takes a tough person to beat this disease but you "can" do it.

Everyone has a different personality. If you tell me I can't do something; it will get done one way or the other. Very single-minded and determined.

Pull on all your resources; there is a rainbow ahead.


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## Jmobie

I just wanted to bump this thread up, because I have been like Opus the last year or two, thinking that my mental decline was due to depression (my mom passed away in 2010) and aging. My job performance as an intern with my current employer back in 2009 was excellent and was the reason they hired me back as full-time. My first year in 2010 was also pretty good. But it's been downhill from there. I am a statistician and work with other statisticians and actuaries, and I feel they have been flying past me on the highway recently. All my motivation to learn new statistical formulas and methods that was there after graduation and upon hiring has vanished. Part of my job description is to translate numbers into English. Hahaha! It takes me twice as long now to see numerical patterns, if I do find them, and then I bumble and stumble around in my delivery. I often feel that there would be no chance I would be hired if I was an outsider and interviewed for my position today. People probably think I don't have any personality in public. What really happens is that my mind is going in circles figuring out what to say next. I'm okay at continuing conversations, but absolutely terrible at breaking silence. I hate elevator rides at work and sometimes choose the stairs, even while working on floor 19. All that effort to break out of my shell in college has gone down the drain. When I found out at the beginning of this year that Free T3 should be at the 75% mark, and I was living with it being around 0% for the last 8 years while on Levothyroxine, it was like I burst out of my catatonia, filled with both flabbergast and ecstacy. I immediately started a new treatment of NP Thyroid with my endocrinologist, and I'm now up to 75 mg/d, with a 248 FT3 (230-420). I'm driving on this new journey, and my endo can be in the passenger seat. My symptoms are my GPS. If she wants to take a different direction, I'll find a new partner. I can't complain yet though as she let me come in the day after I e-mailed her about my complete brain fog (I took both days off) and started me on NP Thyroid 60 mg without any tests. Two days later was my most productive workday in months. So because of that stretch of days, I feel indebted to her. But still, I have been concerned these past few days whether some of these mental impairments are permanent (these concerns come and go as I recover). This thread has given me some more hope. It will be such an amazing and intense feeling- probably one I have never felt before- when I will be able to think and look like myself once again! :hugs: arty0048: arty0045: arty0009: :jumping0047: arty0049: :anim_26:


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## bigfoot

Hey, that's great news!!

I really like how you described the brain fog. What you mentioned sounds a lot like what I've been going through in some ways. It's interesting to see how various thyroid medication doses and types (T4 vs T3 vs T4/T3 vs compounded T3) affect everything.

I can tell you that I also worried such changes were permanent, but when I've had a fleeting moment of things being lined up properly, it's like old times. The trick is finding that sweet spot!


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## I DClaire

bigfoot said:


> Hey, that's great news!!
> 
> I really like how you described the brain fog. What you mentioned sounds a lot like what I've been going through in some ways. It's interesting to see how various thyroid medication doses and types (T4 vs T3 vs T4/T3 vs compounded T3) affect everything.
> 
> I can tell you that I also worried such changes were permanent, but when I've had a fleeting moment of things being lined up properly, it's like old times. The trick is finding that sweet spot!


I read this entire thread and started crying. I'm not at the point right now where I'd describe myself as living in a state of altered consciousness BUT I've been telling friends and family members (and my doctors) that I simply do not feel like myself anymore and I honestly haven't in a long time AND the problem is becoming more obvious.

I do not have the attention span of a gnat! I cannot focus on any task and stay with it more than maybe 5 minutes. I've gotten to where if I want to cook, I break down the different components over maybe 2-3 days because I almost get dizzy trying to concentrate on recipes.

Something happened Sunday night that has scared me. I don't think my husband thinks I'm telling the truth but we've followed Downton Abbey ever since the series began. Sunday night the last show of the third season was going to be on from 8:00-10:00 P.M. I sat down and for whatever reason turned on PBS around 7:15 and they were re-running the previous Sunday's show.

I called my husband to come quickly thinking the last program had started early.

Why?

I had virtually no recollection of the previous week's show even though I sat there and watched it not only with my husband but also our daughter. I HAD LITTLE RECOLLECTION - it was as though I had never seen the program.

I feel like I think relatively well, I ordinarily have a good memory but something really serious is happening and I know it is! It is worrying me to no end. I enjoy sewing and after sewing for over 50 years I can almost look at something and know the measurement or move from measurement to measurement with a total sense of fluidity...but last week I began noticing that that's not happening right now, sometimes I find myself getting hung-up on stuff I should be able to do with my eyes closed.

I am beyond anxious to see my endocrinologist tomorrow and get my latest test results and hopefully have time to discuss my concerns. I'm not so crazy YET that I don't have enough sense to realize something isn't right - the problem is getting anyone to believe me.


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