# I had to go to the ER



## Danniswirl (Feb 23, 2013)

Well..., after my armour starting making me a bit hyper (free T3 4.5), I had to go to ER for fast heart rate, dizziness, and rapid breathing. I brought my last bloodwork with from last week and they were still clueless. They told me stop armour, which I already did and to start it back after 7 days. Meanwhile, my symptoms will continue. They also told me how armour was unstable and not good for hashi. Smh! After they did plenty of test and ruled out heart attack and blood clots, they sent me home. Told me beta blockers were no good for hashi as well! Second smh! They told me to call my endo, which I did fri. AM and he hasn't called me since. He has a habit of not getting back to me. Can I ask here for Dr. suggestions? I live in Philadelphia, Pa , but am moving to Delaware in a few weeks. Is it time to remove my thyroid? I think I'm ready. I'm losing too much time in my life being in bed. I also asked ER doctor could I have adrenal problems? He said my blood pressure was not low enough. I think I'm ready for surgery! Any advice?


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## Andros (Aug 26, 2009)

Danniswirl said:


> Well..., after my armour starting making me a bit hyper (free T3 4.5), I had to go to ER for fast heart rate, dizziness, and rapid breathing. I brought my last bloodwork with from last week and they were still clueless. They told me stop armour, which I already did and to start it back after 7 days. Meanwhile, my symptoms will continue. They also told me how armour was unstable and not good for hashi. Smh! After they did plenty of test and ruled out heart attack and blood clots, they sent me home. Told me beta blockers were no good for hashi as well! Second smh! They told me to call my endo, which I did fri. AM and he hasn't called me since. He has a habit of not getting back to me. Can I ask here for Dr. suggestions? I live in Philadelphia, Pa , but am moving to Delaware in a few weeks. Is it time to remove my thyroid? I think I'm ready. I'm losing too much time in my life being in bed. I also asked ER doctor could I have adrenal problems? He said my blood pressure was not low enough. I think I'm ready for surgery! Any advice?


I am so sorry you landed in the ER! That had to be scary!

What does your thyroid ultra-sound show? You have had one; yes?

Antibodies' tests? You have had them as well?


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## Danniswirl (Feb 23, 2013)

Hi Andros. I haven't had x ray done yet. I am going to schedule it next week. Does this sound like adrenal fatigue? Here is the rest of me test from a week ago.

Tsh: 0.01 
Free T3: 4.5 (2.3 -4.2)
T3 total: 154 (76-181)
Thyroid peroxidase antibodies: <10 (range <35)
Aldosterone LC/MS/MS: 2 (range <35)
Dhea Sulfate: 126 (25-220)
Testosterone total: 62 (2-45)

I asked him to do test for ferritin, vit d, and vit b but don't see them on my paperwork. I'm going next tues (to my general dr. He does the bloodwork), so I will ask him about that. Could they be called something different on my paperwork results? Is there any other test I should request? 
Also, my blood pressure is a bit low (116/67), and now I'm scared I have adrenal fatigue. 
Thanks so much!


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## Danniswirl (Feb 23, 2013)

I mean I haven't had ultrasound yet not X-ray.


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## Danniswirl (Feb 23, 2013)

Oh forgot to mention that in feb. my Thyroglobulin Antibodies test was 81 (normal range <20).


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## I DClaire (Jul 31, 2011)

I thought you were in Shreveport, LA., until I saw Philadelphia, PA. My first trip to the ER last July, with symptoms similar to what you've described, played out a couple of days later with my internist asking if I'd gotten Armour from a "witch doctor"? Not to mention the hospital pharmacist came to my room to tell me they didn't stock Armour and I'd have to furnish my own.

Zoom forward six months to a second trip to the ER on New Years Day morning, same problems only worse - writhing in pain, vomiting, had to be sedated by IV...and internist #2 looks at me and says, "Well, considering that stuff you take (referring to Armour), it's no telling what's wrong with you." I went home, made an appointment with a gastro-intestinal specialist who saw me very quickly and was shortly thereafter diagnosed with a raging UTI (after the ER and doctor #2 said that was fine), H Pylori bacterial infection in my stomach and scheduled for a CT scan and later a biopsy on my pancreas!

It has been my 100% negative experiences with doctors other than my endocrinologist and the G-I specialist that swayed me back to Synthroid. You might think I'm going to some rural hospital but I've been hospitalized in the most highly respected medical center where I live...and yet nobody has an inkling about TSH (in particular) with Armour.

I did not realize it at the time and I don't know if the extreme anxiety I developed was directly related to taking Armour OR got started because I'd have the other traumatizing symptoms and then panic but when I stopped Armour, the anxiety attacks (at least so far) disappeared.

There is a page on Facebook, I think titled something like "Thyroid Change" where a senator or some elected official in Kentucky or maybe Tennessee has agreed or wants to seek help for what so many thyroid patients go through with doctors and hospitals. They're asking people to share their stories and for as much as everyone's story is a little different, there is also a distinct thread of similarity to what many of us have experienced. It is interesting and humbling to read the stories.


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## Danniswirl (Feb 23, 2013)

Hi I D Clair, how are you doing on Synthroid now. How are you doing without t3 in he Synthroid?


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## I DClaire (Jul 31, 2011)

Danniswirl said:


> Hi I D Clair, how are you doing on Synthroid now. How are you doing without t3 in he Synthroid?


I have generally felt better on Synthroid than on Armour. I've only had tests one time (three weeks ago) and I thought my results were perfect but my doctor wants me to take 137 mcg six days a week and half that dose on Sundays. I went into a really dramatic downturn - I began having excruciating muscle pain in both legs and both arms.

Last Wednesday I started taking CoQ10 and overnight felt wondrously better! I'm very hopeful the combination of the supplement and Synthroid may be very positive for me.

My last test results were, and don't ask me about the TSH! :confused0006:

T4 Free (range 0.8-1.5) - my result was 1.4

T3 Free (range 2.0-3.6) - I was 3.1

TSH (range 0.37-4.55) - my result was 0.013 ...and my doctor changed the dosing.

Overall, I'm more encouraged right now than ever before. One thing is a natural fact - there is no one size fits all with this stuff! I'm almost afraid to let myself believe or get too excited because I know how quickly it can all fall apart.


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## Danniswirl (Feb 23, 2013)

I understand. Looks like your heading on the right track. I have done well on armour previously. I believe that I tittered too high. I wonder should I restart Armour or give Syntyroid another try. I don't have much trust in dr.'s.


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## lainey (Aug 26, 2010)

> Tsh: 0.01
> Free T3: 4.5 (2.3 -4.2)


Ummm, you have hyper symptoms and hyper blood work. The suppressed labs are going to raise eyebrows where ever you go, no matter what you read on the internet. What exactly were you expecting the ER to do for you that reducing the medication won't solve?

Unless you have had cancer, 99% of the population has no need to be medicated to that level. People like to forget that some of the symptoms of over medication are exactly the same as undermedication as well.



> my blood pressure is a bit low (116/67)


This is not low blood pressure, but in fact a wonderful normal blood pressure reading.

Most doctors don't recognize adrenal fatigue, only adrenal insufficiency. If you research it, you will find that lifestyle changes and supplements are the usual treatments. You might find a naturopath or DO that would test you and give you steroids for a short period if you are low but don't test positive for Addison's.


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## Andros (Aug 26, 2009)

Danniswirl said:


> Oh forgot to mention that in feb. my Thyroglobulin Antibodies test was 81 (normal range <20).


Hoh, boy..............you do need to schedule an ultra-sound because Thyroglobulin Ab does suggest that cancer has to be ruled in or out.

So please do that.

I am not much of an adrenal expert so maybe someone else can answer your question on that.

In regards to Ferritin; that is the name of the test. No other. Ferritin is the protein that stores iron for cellular uptake. It is a very reliable test for anemia.

Here is info on the Thyroglobulin and Thyroglobulin Ab.

Thyroglobulin Ab
A negative test is normal. A negative test means no antibodies to thyroglobulin are found in your blood.
http://www.nlm.nih.gov/medlineplus/ency/article/003557.htm
(The normal thyroid has Thyroglobulin in low titers but should not have Thyroglobulin Ab)

cancer TPO and thyroglobulin
http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1111/j.1699-0463.1994.tb04888.x/abstract
http://www.wikigenes.org/e/gene/e/7173.html

Understanding Thyroglobulin Ab.
http://www.labtestsonline.org/understanding/analytes/thyroglobulin/test.html

Thyroglobulin Ab and cancer
http://qjmed.oxfordjournals.org/content/59/2/429.full.pdf


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## Danniswirl (Feb 23, 2013)

Ok. Thank you all!


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## Danniswirl (Feb 23, 2013)

Thank you Lainey.


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## surge (Aug 15, 2012)

You may have adrenal issues, but I agree with Lainey that the symptoms you're experiencing are hyper symptoms and you are overmedicated, so regardless of what replacement you're on, backing off on that is essential and when you go back on, making a downward adjustment from where you were. I go hyper when my levoxyl/synthroid is slightly too high, and I hate it. It's the scariest feeling, so I understand why you were in the hospital and hope you're starting to feel better.

Why did you try Armour to begin with? Were you on a t4 only and what symptoms weren't being addressed?


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## Danniswirl (Feb 23, 2013)

Hi Surge... yes, I stopped my armour thyroid now for a week. I was so scared. I thought I was going to die. All i kept thinking was, who is going to take care of my kids if i die??? Anyway I will start back on Thurs. I do feel better. My pulse has been averaging 60 bpm now. My blood pressure is normal. Now i started thinking is my pulse too low? Thus leading me to think i have adrenal issues. I think i have been a panicky mess. But I do feel better. Synthroid made me have edema. I was miserable. Armour has made me feel better for the most part. I will definitely lower my dosage and follow up with blood work in a month or two. But those symptoms almost scared me to death. The dizziness was the worst. My mom came over this weekend, and my husband helped out more. I started to feel depressed and just layed in bed. Crying....But I am at work now and I feel better. When you get hyper can you feel the hormone surge through your body? I kept feeling it especially at night. I was thinking at least when i was on antidepressants, some of these thyroid issues were masked. I was diagnosed with panic disorder years ago, and I remember all these surges I feel now. I was misdiagnosed. When I was on armour before all the hyper, I never was panicky. I was too tired to panic! I do feel a bit of hypo symptoms coming back now though. Arms are achy and heavy. I go for a ultrasound tomorrow.

thanks so much!:hugs::hugs:


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## surge (Aug 15, 2012)

So, for now, if I were trying to sort this out, I'd just try the lower dose of Armour, and if it doesn't work, you start going hyper again, then I'd try a T4 like Synthroid with a T3 supplement and see.

I think your adrenals could be involved, but your thyroid is the main thing right now. The whole 'adrenal insufficiency/fatigue' diagnosis is controversial and kind of a moving target. The body can take care of this usually on its own if you support yourself well...unless you have an extreme condition like Addison's or Cushing's. The best way to take care of the adrenals is also a pretty good way to take care of you in general. Limit caffeine and sugar, get plenty of rest, get exercise but avoid peak cardio-- favor yoga/pilates/walking instead for now, but do get the exercise. consider increasing salt intake a bit if you're feeling low. Adrenals love the salt. Don't stress out too much about adrenals yet since your symptoms right now are probably all thyroid related. If you find euthyroid and still feel draggy, that's when I'd explore the adrenal issue.

It sucks to be up and down and I know how frustrating it can be during the worst weeks. But you're learning more and more about your body and what it needs so you're also learning what to ask for, and that's something. The more you know the better you can advocate for yourself, which just might get you to a better place a little sooner...


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## Danniswirl (Feb 23, 2013)

Yes Surge!! I do feel like i'm learning about my body! I believe that protocol sounds good as now I'm starting to feel a bit hypo after 6 days off Armour.

thank you so much!


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